Reprinted from the HSBBWeb Message Boards
Coach Johnson posted on 12/19
Showcases are a waste of time?
I am the head baseball coach at a mid size school in the west.
I am just giving by honest opinion, on this as I have been asked
several times. I do not wish to put my view on you, only voicing my
opinion, for whatever that is worth.
I think that they are expensive and most of the kids that attend are
not going to receive scholarship money. It is a pipe dream for the
parents, (and a money maker for the directors), who continue to hand
over there hard earned money for these showcases. If your kid is good
they will find him. Don't worry there are very few diamonds in the
rough out there. Please parents save your money, play summer travel
ball, fall ball, send films to schools of interest, that will do
alot more then what you think.
southpawmom posted on 12/19
re: Showcases are a waste of time?
I think it depends entirely on the situation. If you have a kid that goes to a school were baseball scouts don't come, then you need the showcases for exposure. It simply is not true that they will find you. Maybe they will find you if you high school coach has connections and he makes phone calls but that's about it. I also believe you can send lots of letters but that doesn't necessary mean that school will be interested in you. Chances are they will sent you information about their camp because they want to SEE you.
Now a showcase is a good way to be seen but the issue is are you there because mom and dad think you are good enough or because you really are good. You go to a showcase to be seen but thee college coaches and scouts and they are really evaluating you and if you don't get something you keep trying because it takes one coach to make a match.
Personally I think the best bet is to try and get an honest assessment of the kids ability and send him to camps at colleges that may be a fit. This gives the college a full week to look at him and is the best bet.
But back to showcases, they do work as my kid got several offers and has only been to two showcases, but accepted a college whose camp he had been to and none of these places would have been to see him so he went to them.
TRhit posted on 12/19
re: Showcases are a waste of time?
Coach
Is that mid size school a high school or a college?
if it is a college what division is it?
How long have you been coaching?
How long as a head coach?
BBMOM2002 posted on 12/19
re: Showcases are a waste of time?
I hear you but how do you explain the notations of about 1/2 of the
player questionaires that my son has received to date that have the
showcase noted either at the top or bottom of the form? Several have
T96 (my guess is Top 96) the other have had Select (College Select?).
These were the 2 showcase he attended as a Soph.
playerparent posted on 12/19
re: Showcases are a waste of time?
I agree that showcases CAN be a waste of time and money. If a player is seen by scouts and colleges in his regular schedule, then a showcase may not give him any additional exposure. In my son's case, he was injured in his jr. year and had a solid but not exceptional spring. He had written a few schools and got the usual form letters back (with camp info), but he received NO real interest. In the fall season he played in a very good wood bat league that culminated in a local showcase with some of the area jr. college players. He performed well at the showcase and within two weeks he was contacted by 3D1s, 1D2s, and 6 jcs (he has received offers from all 3 that he has visited so far). And oh yes, he was visited by the mlb scouting bureau and 2 mlb teams. All from a local showcase with limited attendance by scouts. All of these scouts and coaches said they saw him at the showcase.
No one strategy works for all kids, but in my son's case, I think it is possible that he would not have had the opportunity to be seen and noticed without this showcase.
(at the very least, he made up for lost time of his jr. year). He now has been invited to a "national" showcase and will attend. Try telling him that showcases are a waste.
The bottom line is that talent and ability rule, but someone must hear that tree that falls in the forest.
BeenthereIL posted on 12/19
re: Showcases are a waste of time?
I disagree vehemently with Coach Johnson. I have some connections so
I would suppose that that would put my son in a category where he
would not need to be "seen".
However....
It is IMPORTANT for him to compete against the best in the local area,
region; and, yes, in the country, if his aspirations are to play
professionally or at a major D1 school.
I have no vested interest in any showcase, nor do I know any of the
men/ladies that run these showcases personally. It seems, however,
from talking with most parents who have sons who participated in
several different kinds of showcases, it was well worth the few
hundred dollars for the exposure which resulted in a greater amount
of interest shown by the various schools/coaches who attended the
showcases. Of course, as the Coach suggests, some have had their
bubble burst. Isn't it better now than later?
There are several posters who have had their sons "noticed" and have
received far more substantial college offers than would otherwise
have materialized if they sat at home and waited for the phone to
ring.
My guy is looking forward to next spring and summer. We'll see how
his spring and summer go this year (he's only a freshman) and that
will determine whether he is invited as a result of his own "on field"
performance; or, whether we have to spend an additional few bucks to
go to some of the showcases to get him "noticed"
As a matter of fact, we will be traveling a bit over the holidays to
a hitting camp and to see campuses...and be back in time for
Christmas dinner at 2:00 p.m., on the 25th. Just father and son.
Scdad posted on 12/19
re: Showcases are a waste of time?
If as a parent you can afford to send your son to national type
showcases, I certainly would encourage you to do so. My son attended,
even after committing in the early signing period, in order to
determine how he compared to other national talent; as it turned
out, it gave him confidence for his summer season with a higher
profile traveling team. As with most issues, there is no right answer
for all. In parting- in defense of MOST showcase promoters, the love
of the game is the driving force, not monetary rewards.
Gary19 posted on 12/19
re: Showcases are a waste of time?
Beenthere,
Just curious. Why are you visiting campuses? I know your older boy
is done with school, and the latest one is just a freshman. Do you
have another child that is a junior or senior? Seems a bit premature
to be visiting for the freshman.
Gary
Showparent posted on 12/20
re: Showcases are a waste of time?
Coach Johnson, it is amazing to hear you say such a thing that
showcases are a waste of time being a high school coach. I have
seen over 100 kids receive college scholarships due to exposure at
showcases. It sounds to me after talking to a few high school coaches
that alot of them have the same beliefs as Johnson, but yet half of
the ones I have talked with have never even attended a showcase. It
sounds to me that because of Showcase High School coaches are loosing
alot of credibility. I know when they recruited my son they did not
even talk to the high school coach, and I don't blame them. Before my
son attended the Best of the West Early Signing Showcase at Loyola
Marymount California no one was really recruiting him, by the time
he left the showcase he had a SCHOLARSHIP at Loyola Marymount
University. The money I spent was well worth the results and I
recommend to all players if you get a chance to attend a good showcase
go! Coach Johnson I don't know what type of coach you are but if you
are not having your best players attend showcases then you are losing
out. Remember when one of your players do well at a showcase it brings
recognition to your program which enables you to have more players
recognized. Again, if it wasn't for the showcase we attended this
fall my son would have probably missed the opportunity to play
college baseball.
Coach Johnson posted on 12/20
re: Showcases are a waste of time?
I am not saying that you shouldn't attend a showcase, but why repeat
edly. If you have gained the necessary exposure ( that is why you are
there) why waste the money on multiples. For everyone that comes away
with a scholarship from these, there are very many that don't. I have
seen too many kids go to these camps and come away with nothing. Then
turn around and go again the next week.
I think that all kids can play at some level, and that's what they
should spend there time on, finding a place to play. Not trying to
impress some D1 scout that is looking for his 25 and 26 signing this
year. Please don't take this the wrong way I am in it because I love
the game and I do not like to see the kids get hurt. In addition, I
do not believe that high schools coaches are losing credibility, As
a college coach I talk to them all the time.
I do value there opinions.
BeenthereIL posted on 12/20
re: Showcases are a waste of time?
Showparent...Great post. If you've got a couple of bucks, use them on
your son!
Gary...We're on our way to a 2-day camp and decided that we would do
a "whirlwind" tour of a few major college campuses before Christmas
and his required return to Chicagoland for basketball practice. We
should see: Kentucky; Tennessee; Georgia; Duke and North Carolina...
who knows...maybe Ohio State, Indiana and Purdue on the way back.
TRhit posted on 12/20
re: Showcases are a waste of time?
Beenthere--
Quite an ambitious schedule for a lad so young, is it not? After
all he is but a freshman.
Hope the kid can handle pressure because it is beginning to become
a pressure cooker.
And his "required" return for basketball !!! Now now !!!!!
I thought I drove my kid hard-- I was a saint compared to this !!
Have a happy !!!!
Gary19 posted on 12/20
re: Showcases are a waste of time?
Beenthere,
Don't mean to gang up on you, but I do wonder. At least in Cleveland,
basketball is in mid-season. Why leave for baseball now and neglect
roundball? Who is requiring your son to attend practice, and how was
he able to be excused for this trip? Maybe he should be thankful, no
HS coach in this area would allow it (nor should they). Would the
baseball coach allow him to miss time in May for a basketball camp
and visits to colleges along the way? At least here, I don't think
so.
I won't even get into your choice of colleges for a freshman to
visit. Ambitious isn't the word. By the way, since when is eight
campuses "a few"?
Gary19 posted on 12/20
re: Showcases are a waste of time?
Back to the topic. I more than understand the potential value of
showcases from the time I have spent on this site. HOWEVER, I do
wonder about the obsession with attending as many showcases as
possible, as I read a number of people doing here. I also wonder
about the "need" to attend numerous showcases as a sophomore. Yes,
it might be nice to get noticed and followed by schools, but I
refuse to believe that if a player shows himself as a junior, or
even a senior, he will be passed over for a lesser talent who was
"discovered" in 10th grade (or 9th, or 5th, or T-ball).
Unless there are a lot more independently-wealthy people out there
than me, why not spend the money on lessons, practice times,
tournaments, a normal family vacation, etc.? Then showcase as a junior
or senior when you are mature. If you are seen by the "right person"
then it will mean just as much, if not more, than being seen in 9th
grade.
We have gone to one showcase for the experience and education of
learning what they are like and how they are run. Don't plan on
doing anymore more until next summer, and IF THINGS KEEP PROGRESSING
(and trust me, no matter what you think now there is no guarantee of
that), will hit more in the summer of 2002.
I also think a kid needs to develop a focus and plan of where they
would like to attend school. Why showcase in parts of the country
that you do not necessarily want to play in and attend school
(remember that part of it folks)? Have a plan, do not just randomly
go all over the country to whatever showcase will take your son.
Just some thought and questions from someone still new at this.
Tom posted on 12/20
re: Showcases are a waste of time?
Coach Johnson does not have a clue regarding the value of the top showcase events.
My son signed a 90 percent scholarship with a major D-1 baseball program. He also had similar offers from other elite baseball programs.
These offers came from colleges not located in our home state. He received little interest from the in state schools. All of the out of state schools saw him play at major showcases. Because our HS program is not well know it is not normally scouted.
As far as traveling every weekend to a different showcase, I do agree there is little value in spending the extra money.
Coach Johnson posted on 12/20
re: Showcases are a waste of time?
Gary19
I believe you are the only one that gets what I am trying say.
Tom why do you attack me personally, I am only stating my opinion.
That's great that your kid got a D1 scholarship. Now, why don't you
continue to take him to some more showcases, go ahead spend the money
it has been worth it. You see how ridiculous that sounds. That's all
I am saying folks, is be careful, let the kids enjoy the game. You
would be surprised at who's watching.
hsbbweb posted on 12/20
re: Showcases are a waste of time?
Gary19,
You take on this topic is right on the money! Money spent on lessons
is usually a better investment than most of the showcases. Too many
parents spend money chasing every showcase that comes by.
There is no doubt that the top showcases are an invaluable exposure
opportunity for a player.
As I have stated before -- If you are invited to one of these events
by all means try to attend. BUT -- why go to 5 different showcases the
summer between your junior and senior year? I can think of no valid
reason.
For a younger player, (sophomore or freshman) I suggest attending a
free pro try-out day in your area. This gives the player a sampling of
the routine at a showcase and a chance to measure himself against his
peers.
Additionally if a player is interested in a particular school try to
attend one of their camps.
I am finding too many parents that are dragging the players from
showcase event to showcase event. I do not believe the saying "If
you are good enough "they" will find you." But there does have to be
a happy medium.
I know several players that are still waiting to be found. Use common
sense when considering showcase options. Ask questions about them in
this forum.
Northofsuperior posted on 12/20
re: Showcases are a waste of time?
To BeenthereIl:
Best of luck on your whirlwind tour. Have a safe journey. I look
forward to your observations on the schools you visit, if only
briefly.
Coach Johnson:
As far as showcases are concerned, I have spoken to more that one
College coach who agrees completely with you. There are schools who
do not attend these events, and believe than the network they have
for finding players is more than adequate. Having stated that, for
our own personal reasons - geographical location - my son must travel
to have chance to be seen, and one or two showcases per year would
seem to get the most bang for our buck. Hopefully from these events
he will attend a camp at a school that may have some genuine interest
in him.
Bob:
As usual, your common sense approach to the recruiting question is
excellent. However, If someone out there has a simple answer to finding
the right fit for my son, please forward it along. For this family,
every decision must be informed, given the long distances to be
traveled.
I wish every family involved in the process all the success possible!
The Principal posted on 12/20
My personal opinion
There is value in camps, lessons, fall ball, legion ball, and showcases.
The key to that is knowing where the mix lies for a specific player so
that you can get the best return on the money spent. Because it all
cost money no way to get around that. And you have to know the
realistic ability level of the player too.
Best money spent here was on hitting lessons in the region at a
batting facility. That lead to an invitation to play on a fall select
team that was managed by the owner of the batting facility. He ran an
excellent fall program and the team played 40 games each fall for two
years. Eighty games is a lot of baseball experience for a player prior
to his senior season. The fall team experience was a springboard to
letters and contacts from college programs and some of the showcases.
We felt the first season of fall would would be great for exposure.
However, I think we all realized that the greatest point of fall ball
was not exposure, but experience against good competition. You would
go to bat each weekend against four or five pitchers throwing in the
80's or occasionally in the 90's.
My nephew gave up playing in local all-star competition one season to
got to two camps and a local showcase. It was well worth it as we got
letters of interest from schools indicating that they had seen him play
at the showcase or at that school's
camp. There is a definite value in going to a specific school's camp
as it is going to an open showcase. You just have to be careful in the
fact are you going for instruction or are you going for exposure.
Sometimes you can't have both.
We followed the advice of this board too and became proactive on making
schools aware of my nephew's desire to play college baseball. We mailed
many letters, got many questionnaires back, made copies and records of
all materials and kept them in a 3-ring binder. Made follow up calls,
made a home made video to show some skills, sent schedules, etc. If
there is one word that people must have in their vocabulary is that
you must MARKET a player.
I agree with Bob in that the old adage of "if you are a good player,
they will find you" is a false one today. College coaches have too
many demands on their time to be out scouting the bushes to find a
single talented player. You have to MARKET your son (or nephew) to
open the door of opportunity. Once that door is open, they you may
find them at games, and calling the house each week.
We have been the Area Code Tryout route, the Team One Showcase route,
and local showcases. You have to do those as your wallet permits to
get out and be seen against the best competition. Scouts and colleges
are going to flock to a single area where there is a multitude of
players participating. Makes sense as they get more return on their
money also. I sometimes think that it is as important to show that
you belong at one of those events as much as shining. What I mean
is that you are not a "sore thumb" for lack of ability, but you can
hold your own.
Oddly enough, this past summer, the one between his junior and senior
year, the local legion coach did not even allow my nephew to try out
for the local team. His reasoning was that if he was going to go to
Area Code/Team One/Best In Virginia and a couple of weekend pitcher-
catcher camps, then he was not dedicated to the legion program. The
coach also told us that my nephew would get more exposure from legion
this summer than from going to those events. We respectfully disagreed
and participated in those events listed above. It was sad not to have
a summer team to keep as sharp as you can, but he had to do other
things to make up for that. I wonder how many players off that legion
team have gotten as many letters or phone calls of late? Currently
there are teams calling basically each week from the Big East, Big
South, CAA, and Southern Conferences...as well as several DIII
programs that are exceptionally strong in our area.
I guess overall it comes to what is best for the player, what are
his specific needs, what level can he play to, what levels of exposure
does he need to maximize his potential, and to what level can this be
funded with out of pocket money. If you can answer those questions you
can find the true value of preparation and marketing.
Good luck to everyone...
Mom Down Under posted on 12/20
re: My personal opinion
Great posts everyone. I am always extremely interested in experiences
and outcomes from the various showcases.
We are targeting specific colleges of interest due to distance from
Australia and challenge of combining strong academics and strong
baseball.
BeenThere,
I have a mother-son thing going at the moment, leaving the West Coast
tonight for a short midwest program. I guess your weather in Georgia
and NC isn't much warmer than Chicagoland. Our son will get an
excellent idea of winter in the midwest and Northeast. Look forward
to hearing about your travels.
Gary21,
Are you around? You mentioned in one post wishing you'd attended more
showcases -- is that still your view?
Thank you.
BBMOM2002 posted on 12/21
re: My personal opinion
This has been a great thread! I'd like to add to my post to state that
I agree with most have said here. We chose to attend 2 showcases last
summer for the following reasons. 1) Just to see what it was all about
and 2) Most important the schools my son is most interested in were to
be in attendance. I feel he got the exposure he was looking as he has
heard from a number of the schools he is interested in. I can honestly
say we got more than our money worth for both the experience and the
exposure.
I also feel showcases are more for the pitcher and catcher. If my
observations were correct the scouts always hung around the pitchers.
During game situation they always had gun in hand. Again just a
parents observation.
BeenthereIL posted on 12/21
re: My personal opinion
Dear Everyone...
The longer distance trip is on hold/cancelled because of my mother-in-
laws health (learned last night)...and, because of the weather forecast
in the Southeast...Atlanta, etc. We'll sacrifice a hundred bucks not to
be a thousand miles away from home and sliding along a country road!
Looks like the second week in August next year would be more
appropriate given his spring and summer baseball schedule.
Since grandma is only 150 miles away, we might take a tour of a few
(3) midwest schools, i.e., Michigan, Notre Dame and Purdue (where one
of my daughters graduated from)...and then across the State of Indiana
to Charleston, Illinois to see grandma and be with her for a few days
during Christmastime.
Notwithstanding what some of my fellow posters suggest, this trip
was my son's idea. He's the one that wanted to go to the Georgia 2-day
camp to meet Ron Polk and see the Georgia complex in Athens. It was
my suggestion, however, that since we were going to be driving, that
we stop at Kentucky and Tennessee (all along the way to Georgia);
and, then he suggested that on the way back we stop at North Carolina
and Duke.
In the past, on long weekends, we've gone to New York City one weekend
and to Washington, D.C., on another, as a "spur of the moment" thing
and we've had a TREMENDOUS experience! Maybe not for everyone, but
it works for us/him. He's looking forward to getting his learner's
permit in February so that he can do the driving! I think that, too,
will be a FUN experience for both of us! I'm looking forward to it!
Gary...
While he starts on the freshman basketball team, all of the coaches at
the high school know that baseball is his best sport. This longer trip
would not have affected any of his practices since we would have left
in about 21 minutes and headed South. As it is, he doesn't have
practice, again, until the 26th. We would have been back by then.
TR...
Most sons should have a father like me. Absolutely no
pressure. All I say is do what you want to do and give it your best
shot. He makes suggestions (some that I can't afford); I make
suggestions; and, he does what he wants to do. With the way he
can throw a football, you would think that he would play football.
All of his friends want him to play. The coaches want him to play.
He doesn't want to play. He thinks football (at this time, anyway)
is boring. He's a former AAU/Junior Olympic karate champion
(We traveled all over the country for his karate
(and with his brother's) that gave up the sport so he can chase girls!
His idea...I supported him. All 5 of my sons are gifted athletes.
Off to pick him up from practice.
Tenndad posted on 12/21
re: My personal opinion
We chose to attend one showcase that would target college and
pro scouts. It was an invitation to the East Coast Pro Showcase.
All our money went into camps at schools my son was interested in
and making him a better player. We turned down perfect game and some
others thinking it would cost alot of money and be an overkill. If a
family thinks a showcase gives there son a leg up on a college
scholarship, then I think you should do what is best for your son.
Everyone's situation is different according to the success of the
high school program they play for and the scouts who come and watch
that program play (If any). Some of the best players I've seen don't
always play for the best teams that get noticed.
As for BeentherIl: I have been talking to him over a year and have
gotten a good idea of what his family is like. They are a die hard
baseball family who's children have the same passion for the game as
there father. The Freshman son wants to visit these campuses and the
father is taking time to make it happen. He has had one son make it
to the pro's after a successful sec college career and I see no reason
the younger son will not take the same path. His son has the want to
and the talent to make it and his father has seen enough good players
to recognize that talent. Your posts imply he is dragging his son all
over the place and I say it just may be the son dragging the father.
Gary19 posted on 12/21
re: My personal opinion
Tenndad,
Agreed, but that is why children have parents (or at least should).
To provide perspective, and limits, and guidelines, and jusgement,
and common sense, etc. It would be a long, cold day before my
14-year-old "drags" me to that many cities (and states) in that
period of time.
Tenndad posted on 12/21
re: My personal opinion
I agree with just about everything you have posted gary19.
Having a younger son who has lived in the shadow of a older
successful baseball brother can sometimes make that younger child
feel neglected and a failure in the child's eyes. So why even try
if you can't measure up to big brother? We as parents sometimes try
to encourage that younger brother to be his own man and be the best
he can be in any way we can to motivate him.
Mista P posted on 12/21
re: Showcases are a waste of time?
Coach Johnson:
It's true that the top line players don't really need to showcase.
They just have to get some coaches down to watch in season (they have
to be very proactive to get that done). But I think you overlook a
point you made yourself about a kid being able to play at some school
somewhere (not a D1 school). I have seen many "less" talented kids
approached by D2,D3, and small programs at these showcases. Most of
the showcases are full of coaches from local, smaller schools, where
they get more bang for their buck. I think if parents and kids would
lower expectations the showcase experience can be very valuable.
Scdad posted on 12/21
re: Showcases are a waste of time?
Many of the top college programs in our area of the country, SOUTH,
are hosting summer and fall league tournaments inorder to have the
opportunity to see multiple top players - in essence, an "in-house"
showcase, and many of the other smaller college coaches then attend.
Beenthere-
You will love the Duke campus; see Coach Hillier-head Baseball and
Coach Filipek, recruiting coordinator, when you do get down this way.
You have already received a wonderful gift this season, with the
relationship you have with your son.
pitcherlefty posted on 12/23
re: Showcases are a waste of time?
Showcases are definately not a waste of time! If you can't get scouts
to your school because it doesn't have much of a team how else to you
get seen. You go to camps and showcases, then as a follow up they may
come to your school. If you want to play college ball exposure is the
key and what more convient for a coach then to go to one spot to see a
bunch of kids?
wolfpride posted on 12/29
re: My personal opinion
I AM OF THE OPINION THAT PITCHING IS THE #1 REASON SCOUTS GO TO
SHOWCASES BECAUSE EVERYONE WANTS MORE PITCHERS, DUE TO THE RISKS THAT
PITCHERS PRESENTS (ARM INJURIES). HOWEVER, MY SON, A CATCHER, AFTER
ATTENDING 2 SHOWCASES HAS BEEN CONTACTED BY 2 SMALL D3 SCHOOLS. WE
HAVE LEARNED THAT HITTING AND FIELDING AT ABOVE AVERAGE SKILL IS NOT
ENOUGH. A POSITION PLAYER MUST BE A FAST BASE RUNNER AND HAVE A STRONG
THROWING ARM. I THINK THE SHOWCASES GAVE MY SON THE BEST CHANCE TO BE
SEEN. WE REALIZED THAT SPEED AND AGILITY TRAINING WAS OUR NEXT PRIORITY.
HE MUST REDUCE HIS 60 YD TIME BY .7 SECONDS. HE HAS BEEN IN TRAINING FOR
5 WEEKS &HAS IMPROVED 40 BY .4 SEC. SO MY ADVICE IS IF A KID IS SLOW
HE NEEDS THIS TYPE OF TRAINING AS MUCH BASEBALL TRAINING.
TRhit posted on 12/29
re: My personal opinion
As one who runs showcases as well as a select team in showcase/
tournaments I find it difficult to understand Coach Johnson's thinking.
With the budget restraints being what they are I have found that college
coaches and pro scouts much prefer to attend showcases and team
tournaments because of the number of players that can be seen in one
sitting. They truly do not have the time nor money to travel to see one
player in hopes of finding a "player".
For this reason, myself and others in the showcases field strive to
give the coaches and players the best situation possible for talent
to be seen.
player27 posted on 12/30
re: My personal opinion
I attended the Area code games and not only got a lot of great offers
as a result that lead to a great scholarship, but also had the BEST
baseball experience i have ever had. the whole deal was a players dream
with some of the best talent in the country competing, a great college
field to play on, pro scouts coaching, etc etc. I would never pass
this up if you get a chance to go to something like this. There's no
doubt I faced players that will some day be future major league stars.
I consider that this lifted my whole baseball perspective up a few
notches.
