quote:

not $3500 like soneone said

JerseyCoach,

That someone would be me ,...and I still have the paperwork
( filed under " ridiculously too expensive for our family " )
that shows the $3500.00 price tag. ( plus airfare/hotel/food/incidentals )

Perhaps different players in different parts of the region received different price tags- that's just my simple guess.(?)
My actual more realistic hunch is that not enough people bit on the original $3500.00 price tag and the tournament roster #'s were too low.
Again,...just MY lil' ol' shortstopmom hunch.

For what its worth, we declined their 1st offer, but about two-three months later they sent us another packet and a few voice messages telling us that the price of the tournament had now been reduced to around $800.
( plus airfare/hotel/food/incidentals. )

Thats a HUGE price drop.
We declined again.

You said:

quote:

I am just trying to understand why "lists" are so important.

...and then go on to say, a mere single sentence later:

quote:

To be on the Rawlings list is a great honor.

Have you answered your own question??????


JerseyCoach quote:

quote:

Go ahead and gripe about marketing tools all you want,it's a shame you can't see the tournament for what it is.

Coach,...you are the second person that I have heard from who have said they had a good experience with this tournament. The first one came from a fellow HSBBW'er, named rwulf.
I have to to be honest, I was glad to hear it. I had my doubts about what the quality of the tournament would be like after experiencing what we thought was a very poorly run tryout camp, here in the midwest.
It was good to hear that some people felt they got their monies worth in the end.

The point being,..I don't think you are finding people disputing the experience of the tournament itself,...what most here are disputing is the name associated with the tournament and how many of us perceive it to be misleading.

quote:

I'm not ranting, just asking questions. Still waiting for answers...funny how there are none

Were giving them to you,....funny how you seem to not want to listen to them.
Let's remember,...you brought the issue up here
and we took our time to respond.

You also self titled your thread:

" Under Armour All America Myth "
and started off the thread with :

....

quote:

it annoys me to see the legitamacy of the Under Armour PRE-SEASON All America questioned.

Some of us replied with reasons/answers such as; the use of misleading or questionable marketing tools.

You rejected our replies with :

quote:

Go ahead and gripe about marketing tools all you want,

Ok,... so no matter what we say, you arent budging.
I'm beginning to understand that now, but I question why you titled your thread the way you did.

If you simply wanted to tell about your personal experience with this tournament, why not just title your thread:
" My son participated in the Under Armour All-American Tournament and had a great experience. I'd recomend it! "

Perhaps it would be received with more of an open mind from the readers and do the tournament a better justice.
JMHO.

Why Myths, smoke & mirrors, ...when you can have the truth?

I love to hear opinions ssmom, but I would like to hear some other than the same three people (one of which has PGSTAFF in the name (biased??), the other 2 replying with the same thing over and over without actually attendingthe event). I stopped regarding your rants after reading your blatant lie about 200 players being in attendance at your sons BBF tryout. I have never seen more than 60 players in attendance (as a coach I have been to nearly 20 BBF tryouts/tournaments in the past 4 years in 4 states.), and have had a few of my own players "waitlisted" because BBF did not want more than 65 players in attendance. I have also never seen fewer than 4 BBF staff members in attendance. As far as tardiness, I find that hard to belive since BBF holds their filming/recruiting session at 9:00 and their tryout (the $100 one you mentioned) at 1:00pm for ALL tryouts. So you're saying they skipped the filming session altogether that day, or were making sure they could finish with their other players??? I have also been to 15+ PG events. I believe in doing whatever my players need, but I ALWAYS remind them that it is a business they are getting involved with either way. That's life.

So SSMOM, your telling me BBF reduced the price by 75% after your son received an invitation for the Pre-Season? Are you sure it wasn't an invitation to Omaha or the Arizona Fall Classic? I have had players on my team go to each, and they are that much (I have never heard any complain, however I have not attended either myself). It's funny how people always need to throw in air fare, hotels, etc. as well...as if BBF has stock in those things.

I may have titled the thread poorly, however I truly felt it was a "myth" for anyone to believe that this is in any way a comparison to the Rawlings list or the Aflac game (which is commonly stated). I do not feel one bit that this was the intention, and I see no harm in calling any future college baseball player a "Pre-Season All American". If people paid $799 to be on this roster ("the list") and nothing else, then they are grossly mis-informed about the purpose of the tournament. Slandering does not help educate.

JerseyCoach, I had a feeling you'de come out swinging.
Thats ok,..I'm a big girl and can take your insults, but I do take opposition to being called a liar.

If you like to call my posts " rants " that is your choice.
I have no ax to grind.

It amazes me that because your experience differed greatly than ours, that you have the audacity to call me a liar. Kind of sad on your part because you are simply wrong.

For what its worth,..the filming that you are referring to was an additional HUGE cost, and one that my son and 200 other people chose not to part take in, therefore we stood outside in the heat waiting for the filming ( which did start at 9 am but ran late ) to end.

Now if you would like me to go point by point over this matter with you, I will. Not sure much good it will do, but we can if you wish. Better yet, since you think you know all, how about you tell me how it went? LOL.

quote:

It's funny how people always need to throw in air fare, hotels, etc. as well...as if BBF has stock in those things.

I dont find it funny at all. I find it factual.
For the price of $3500.00 I dont think it would take a hard stretch of the imagination for the public to assume air fare, hotel, etc. might be inclued in that price.

Funny or factual.
I dont find you funny. I find you insulting and I find you rude.

I am glad you had a good experience and I have said that I know of another who has also.
I also thought that perhaps your point of starting this thread was to let others know that this tournament was a good one.

I have a feeling I was wrong.
.....and so are YOU for calling me a " blatant liar ".

Your respnse was expected, which again is why I would really enjoy seeing some others weigh in. I find it hard to believe Under Armour, Baseball America, and Baseball Express would put their name on such a terrible tryout.......

quote:

I find it hard to believe Under Armour, Baseball America, and Baseball Express would put their name on such a terrible tryout.......

Good point......mine exactly.
( We expected better )
Live and learn.

while i have no dog in this fight. i can say i have seen the letter stateing 3500. plus airfare.but you did get (free) ua gear including turfs.this event was in dodgertown. i still think old school when you didn't pay to go to most showcases you were invited,if you had to pay it was no more than a 100.

i understand the chance of a lifetime tourny for younger kids,i wonder how it fits in a hs player?
youth baseball is a multi, boucoup ,big buck business. that may be one of the few recesion proof money makers.

jersey coach

had another son get accepted to MIT. He played no sports and wasn't offered much help financially. We weighed the options and decided it would be more realistic/beneficial to attend an in state Univeristy. Does he still get to call himself an MIT student because he was accepted? Really ask yourself how this process is any different from Pre-Season All America selection. You tryout (apply) and hope to be invited. If possible, you attend.
----------------------------------------------
you can not call yourself, an mit student.if you aren't a student there.

quote:

Originally posted by 20dad:
while i have no dog in this fight. i can say i have seen the letter stateing 3500. plus airfare.but you did get (free) ua gear including turfs.this event was in dodgertown. i still think old school when you didn't pay to go to most showcases you were invited,if you had to pay it was no more than a 100.

i understand the chance of a lifetime tourny for younger kids,i wonder how it fits in a hs player?
youth baseball is a multi, boucoup ,big buck business. that may be one of the few recesion proof money makers.

jersey coach

had another son get accepted to MIT. He played no sports and wasn't offered much help financially. We weighed the options and decided it would be more realistic/beneficial to attend an in state Univeristy. Does he still get to call himself an MIT student because he was accepted? Really ask yourself how this process is any different from Pre-Season All America selection. You tryout (apply) and hope to be invited. If possible, you attend.
----------------------------------------------
you can not call yourself, an mit student.if you aren't a student there.

That's correct, Dodgertown is another tournament a couple of my players have been invited to/attended (you were correct with the price for that event). It seems like you are someone who understands that this is a lot more about the "experience" then "the list". You live once, and for the average player it ends after high school/college. Some people will scoff at the prices, etc...but the truth is there is a market. If there wasn't a market, it wouldn't exist.

----------------------------------
I bet my son, and many others cannot show their future employers an MIT degree (UA Pre-Season All-America certificate) because of the financials. Chances are, a lot of those students unable to attend MIT are more intelligent (future draft picks) then those who were waitlisted (second round of UA invites) and are now attending. Is this process any different? Get used to it people.

Under Armour PRE-SEASON All American? LOL

It reminds me of the Woody Allen movie - where he bought trophies and put them on his coffeetable to impress his girlfriend. LOL

quote:

I love to hear opinions ssmom, but I would like to hear some other than the same three people (one of which has PGSTAFF in the name (biased??), the other 2 replying with the same thing over and over without actually attendingthe event). I stopped regarding your rants after reading your blatant lie about 200 players being in attendance at your sons BBF tryout. I have never seen more than 60 players in attendance (as a coach I have been to nearly 20 BBF tryouts/tournaments in the past 4 years in 4 states.), and have had a few of my own players "waitlisted" because BBF did not want more than 65 players in attendance. I have also never seen fewer than 4 BBF staff members in attendance. As far as tardiness, I find that hard to belive since BBF holds their filming/recruiting session at 9:00 and their tryout (the $100 one you mentioned) at 1:00pm for ALL tryouts. So you're saying they skipped the filming session altogether that day, or were making sure they could finish with their other players??? I have also been to 15+ PG events. I believe in doing whatever my players need, but I ALWAYS remind them that it is a business they are getting involved with either way. That's life.

Listen JerseyCoach… What did I write that caused you to say anything about being (biased)? Look back at the previous posts and tell us where I even made a single comment about the event or the company you are discussing. You sir, are looking for something here that isn't here and I think it is for all the wrong reasons. Why would you be so passionate about this particular subject? People are saying they are glad to hear your son had a good experience. Isn't that all that should count to a parent? Or is there more to your involvement?

You at this point have posted 14 times at this site. Ten of them about this topic but then there are others.

Post #1 by JerseyCoach

quote:

I'm looking to hold an 18U tournament in the Pittsburgh PA area this fall. Any local tournament rosters would be appreciated.

Post #2 by JerseyCoach

quote:

What are some top High Schools, tournament teams, rosters, etc. in the Toronto area? I am looking to begin recruiting in Canada. Thanks in advance for any help.

Post #3 by JerseyCoach

quote:

I am also looking to recruit and hold a tournament near the Toronto area next fall. Any help would be appreciated!

Post #4 by JerseyCoach

quote:

I meant to include 18U

Anyway, here’s a question, based on your post above and these other previous posts… Could it be YOU who is the one that is biased? It seems you know an awful lot about the subject matter here. It’s OK to be honest!

Please note: I'm not questioning anything other than YOU! You have come on here and called an honest person, who has never done anything but try to help people, a liar! What would be her purpose for lying? What is your purpose?

quote:

Originally posted by JerseyCoach:
I've been a "viewer" for a while and it annoys me to see the legitamacy of the Under Armour PRE-SEASON All America questioned.

http://teamonebaseball.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=566678

Legitamacy?
Of what?

A "Pay for All-American" moniker?

Shoot - if I knew that I would have told my son to not work so hard to be an All-American - and I just would have bought it instead.

Thats not marketing - thats just pure BS. IMO.

quote:

Originally posted by JerseyCoach:
I love to hear opinions ssmom, but I would like to hear some other than the same three people (one of which has PGSTAFF in the name (biased??), the other 2 replying with the same thing over and over without actually attendingthe event). I stopped regarding your rants after reading your blatant lie about 200 players being in attendance at your sons BBF tryout. I have never seen more than 60 players in attendance (as a coach I have been to nearly 20 BBF tryouts/tournaments in the past 4 years in 4 states.), and have had a few of my own players "waitlisted" because BBF did not want more than 65 players in attendance. I have also never seen fewer than 4 BBF staff members in attendance. As far as tardiness, I find that hard to belive since BBF holds their filming/recruiting session at 9:00 and their tryout (the $100 one you mentioned) at 1:00pm for ALL tryouts. So you're saying they skipped the filming session altogether that day, or were making sure they could finish with their other players??? I have also been to 15+ PG events. I believe in doing whatever my players need, but I ALWAYS remind them that it is a business they are getting involved with either way. That's life.

So SSMOM, your telling me BBF reduced the price by 75% after your son received an invitation for the Pre-Season? Are you sure it wasn't an invitation to Omaha or the Arizona Fall Classic? I have had players on my team go to each, and they are that much (I have never heard any complain, however I have not attended either myself). It's funny how people always need to throw in air fare, hotels, etc. as well...as if BBF has stock in those things.

I may have titled the thread poorly, however I truly felt it was a "myth" for anyone to believe that this is in any way a comparison to the Rawlings list or the Aflac game (which is commonly stated). I do not feel one bit that this was the intention, and I see no harm in calling any future college baseball player a "Pre-Season All American". If people paid $799 to be on this roster ("the list") and nothing else, then they are grossly mis-informed about the purpose of the tournament. Slandering does not help educate.

JERSEY...I love (BASEBALL FACTORY and PERFECT GAME), and I hate 'em too! Let me explain.

Baseball Factory is right in my backyard, started by a guy who followed me in high school by two years. He asked me to join them when he and his partner decided to start the business. Having been fortunate enough to coach some of the best players in MD back then, they felt I had something to bring to the table...as they saw how me and my coaching staff did everything we could to get our players playing in front of college coaches. I turned him down because I had a good job (with family and bills to pay), and I told him I didn't have the stomach for a business that preys upon parent's emotions. He understood and accepted that I was not a business man. The Factory has given my players over the years wonderful experiences. I mean they have given back to this community. They employ alot of kids around here for summer employment, offer internships in business education, and give many of these guys an early look of what it will be like to coach their own children one day. They have a fantastic staff that I am very familiar with. In my opinion, they don't necessarily offer the best tournaments/on field exposure. What they bring to the table is alot of one-on-one instruction, service and advice. For on field exposure, no doubt about it...PG is as good as it gets. My old team went to Georgia last summer for the WWBA tourney and they were not disappointed.

I gotta run...I'll finish this later.

quote:

Originally posted by PGStaff:

quote:

I love to hear opinions ssmom, but I would like to hear some other than the same three people (one of which has PGSTAFF in the name (biased??), the other 2 replying with the same thing over and over without actually attendingthe event). I stopped regarding your rants after reading your blatant lie about 200 players being in attendance at your sons BBF tryout. I have never seen more than 60 players in attendance (as a coach I have been to nearly 20 BBF tryouts/tournaments in the past 4 years in 4 states.), and have had a few of my own players "waitlisted" because BBF did not want more than 65 players in attendance. I have also never seen fewer than 4 BBF staff members in attendance. As far as tardiness, I find that hard to belive since BBF holds their filming/recruiting session at 9:00 and their tryout (the $100 one you mentioned) at 1:00pm for ALL tryouts. So you're saying they skipped the filming session altogether that day, or were making sure they could finish with their other players??? I have also been to 15+ PG events. I believe in doing whatever my players need, but I ALWAYS remind them that it is a business they are getting involved with either way. That's life.

Listen JerseyCoach… What did I write that caused you to say anything about being (biased)? Look back at the previous posts and tell us where I even made a single comment about the event or the company you are discussing. You sir, are looking for something here that isn't here and I think it is for all the wrong reasons. Why would you be so passionate about this particular subject? People are saying they are glad to hear your son had a good experience. Isn't that all that should count to a parent? Or is there more to your involvement?

You at this point have posted 14 times at this site. Ten of them about this topic but then there are others.

Post #1 by JerseyCoach

quote:

I'm looking to hold an 18U tournament in the Pittsburgh PA area this fall. Any local tournament rosters would be appreciated.

Post #2 by JerseyCoach

quote:

What are some top High Schools, tournament teams, rosters, etc. in the Toronto area? I am looking to begin recruiting in Canada. Thanks in advance for any help.

Post #3 by JerseyCoach

quote:

I am also looking to recruit and hold a tournament near the Toronto area next fall. Any help would be appreciated!

Post #4 by JerseyCoach

quote:

I meant to include 18U

Anyway, here’s a question, based on your post above and these other previous posts… Could it be YOU who is the one that is biased? It seems you know an awful lot about the subject matter here. It’s OK to be honest!

Please note: I'm not questioning anything other than YOU! You have come on here and called an honest person, who has never done anything but try to help people, a liar! What would be her purpose for lying? What is your purpose?

I apologize for believing someone with the name "PGSTAFF" would be biased. How silly of me.

I have not denied being biased. I have scouted and coached accross the country for nearly 20 years. I have held tournaments for my fall teams throughout the country for about 10 years. My experiences with BBF have been second to none, I guess a bias grows. Seems like human nature to me, not something I would ever deny. After all, isn't this supposed to be a fair place to voice an opinion?

My goal was to seperate a PRE-SEASON tournament from an All American list. I thought it would benefit everyone to be better informed. If that is stepping on toes, I apologize.

Still, I have heard the same overblown reactions from the same 3 people.

quote:

Originally posted by JerseyCoach:

My goal was to seperate a PRE-SEASON tournament from an All American list. I thought it would benefit everyone to be better informed.

The best way to seperate it is to take the BS "All-American" out of the title. IMO.

That would help everyone to become better informed. LOL

quote:

Originally posted by itsinthegame:

quote:

Originally posted by JerseyCoach:
I've been a "viewer" for a while and it annoys me to see the legitamacy of the Under Armour PRE-SEASON All America questioned.

http://teamonebaseball.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=566678

Legitamacy?
Of what?

A "Pay for All-American" moniker?

Shoot - if I knew that I would have told my son to not work so hard to be an All-American - and I just would have bought it instead.

Thats not marketing - thats just pure BS. IMO.

Instead your son will be neither...unless he is in the top %1 of players in the country. And then if that's the case, your son doesn't need a moniker at all...

JerseyCoach

quote:

After all, isn't this supposed to be a fair place to voice an opinion?

I dont know Coach,...you tell ME.

Jersey coach,

BS.

Thats about it - Just pure BS.

quote:

Originally posted by JerseyCoach:

Instead your son will be neither

Yeah - tell me all about it Coach.

LOL

quote:

Originally posted by itsinthegame:

quote:

Originally posted by JerseyCoach:

My goal was to seperate a PRE-SEASON tournament from an All American list. I thought it would benefit everyone to be better informed.

The best way to seperate it is to take the BS "All-American" out of the title. IMO.

That would help everyone to become better informed. LOL

Are parents really that naive that they think their son in one of the best in the country? If that really is the case, then I apologize and I can agree with this sentiment.

More nonsensical BS.

Your wasting our time with this blabber. IMO