I have a question for those of you that have been through this before. My son has a very good scholarship offer to a D1 baseball school. Combined with a smaller unrelated scholarship his college cost will be zero (except daily expenses). He is a RHP/Outfielder and has been told he would have the opportunity to do both in college. Professionally he is being viewed as a pitcher. We have filled out many of the standard questinaaires and returned them to the pro teams. He has pitched four games thus far this year and has had anywhere from 4 to 12 pro scouts at each game. He sits at 87-88 with his fastball but has touched 91 this season so far. A scout told us that they project him out at 95mph. He is 6'-4" and weighs 200.He does well in school and gets good grades.
He really wants to play professional baseball and thinks, if drafted, he would like to give it a shot no matter what round he goes in. He says that he has talked to kids playing D1 ball now and they are stressed academically with the new compact college season.He brought up a good point by telling me that every year in college is the same level of competiton and in the pros, assuming you progress, it is more difficult every year. He feels he could make quicker progress in the pros as well if he didn't have to worry about school.
I guess my question is as follows:
Should he follow the conservative route and go to school or should he follow his dream (no matter which round he is drafted in) and go for it?
Each day I have a different opinion and I would be greatful for some input from others who have been there.

To be honest this is a question only he and the family can answer---conditions are different for every kid

Bob, A very good question and a very good position to be in. TRHit is right on. Each player and family is different so obviously there is no cookie cutter approach to this. Let me say my son was drafted in the 5th round by the Cardinals out of high school, chose to go to college, went to college for three years and played three years of SEC college baseball, was drafted in the 6th round out of college and is currently in his third full year of MiLB. We (he) had those choices and we have weighed out the pros and cons in the past so maybe I can share what he went through. I think I would look at the negatives (we did) instead of the positives. In other words what does your son stand to loose if he goes pro out of high school and what would he stand to loose if he goes to college out of high school. The only thing I will say to influence his decision would be --- "If your son has the ability to play professionally, going to college will not destroy that ability unless he has a career ending injury. In fact it could enhance his ability".

Now make a list.

1. What could he loose if he went to college?

2. What could he loose if he went pro?

Good luck and let us know how your thought process is going.

Fungo

BobR,
Welcome. I do agree that this is a personal decision but you asked for some feedback.

They projected my son to be drafted rounds 6-10 out of HS. He was offered a pre draft opportunity by NYY but said no thank you. With a strong college commitment (scholarship) and his desire to go to college he was not drafted at all, and I will admit, the money in those rounds was not enough for HIM to give up college. He also wanted to play pro ball all of his life, just like many of our players.

First do not think that playing baseball for a living is any less stressful than going to college and playing ball. Both have different type of stresses attached. Yes, all you do is play baseball all day, sounds like lots of fun, but do know it becomes your job. Think about your job and the demands and stress that it brings.

Some things to think about and discuss with your son below.

As far as college, MLB has the scholarship plan that pays for your education 100%. However, as far as I see it, there is very little time right now for my son to finish his last year, let alone if he had to begin. Become familiar with the plan and how it works. How much importance so you and your family and son place on furthering one's education.

You can get hurt in college, you can get hurt in professional ball. Where would you rather be doing your rehab?

Is your son a good student, does he have good time management skills? Learning to manage your time between class and a sport is manageable, depends on the player and the support behind him.

Understand the system of pro ball. On one team you can move quickly, on another team you can sit longer than you anticipate.It's not unusual for a player out of HS to put in 2 years in rookie, or one year in rookie and two in low A. Most teams move their HS players very slowly, regardless of the amount of money you receive. Will he be happy many miles away, has he ever been away from home for an extended period of time. Mine was homesick at college, for about 3 days. His team was his extended family at school, it is a bit different in pro ball. Your team are your co workers and they all want the same job. They care about each other, but the team concept is not as strong. It gets tougher as you move along.

If you do not care about the bonus, go play, if you care about the bonus and it isn't enough go to school.

Off season, will your son have to work to pay his bills or can you support him?

Who will be his support system besides you, can he afford an agent.

My son has said on several occassions and will tell you the same to this day, he would not have given up the college experience, even if that meant not making it to pro ball one day. He wqas very fortunate to have a great experience and it preparedhim well for his pro experience.

As said, everyone's situation is different, you might get different answers from those whose sons went right into pro ball out of HS.

The best part is that he has options. He can use those to his advantage, and is in a win win situation.


FYI, projected 6-10 out of HS, he was drafted second round out of college. I agree with Fungo, if he has pro potential, barring an injury, and he works hard, going to college most likely will not change that.
Good luck.

Thanks for the responses. I will print them off and let my son read them. Who knows, he may not get drafted, which would make the choice very easy.

In my opinion there should be no choice other than going pro.... what I mean by that is,life in the minors is a tremendous adjustment for a 18 yr old.
There can be no doubts, if there are, go to college first...There are too many kids who lose the chance of a pro career because they didn't want it bad enough to stick it out.

How many more baseball academies can we support ?

Isnt this where all the draft picks who don't make it out of HS end up with the tag line in their profile "ex pro player".

This is a yearly question and I am going to make a comparison. TPM, I mean no offense and will delete if this bothers you in any way.

TPM's son and mine were in the same draft class, both right handed pitchers. Mine was a projected 1st rounder. He got hurt, tommy john, a month before the draft, wound up being a 14th round pick, signed for second round money.

At this time, he is pitching AAA level, and got a long look at major league camp this spring. TPM's son is in high A.

College and professional are two different games. Aluminum bats v. wood bats, they make the game completely different. I also believe that the learning curve in pro ball is steeper. This is what they do full time. Not class, no NCAA, just baseball, all the time.

Mine has three years of service toward Rule 5 and 40 man roster, TPM's son is not at a full year.

TPM's son has 3 plus years toward a college degree, mine has one, he was able to go to school while he rehabbed.

His rehab was handled by the most professional people in the business, with incredible experience and investment into his well-being. Also had no limits on the amount of time he could spend with coaches will rehabbing.

Homesick is homesick, it doesn't matter if you are at college or pro. Teammates are teammates and they are supportive. The friends that son has made in pro ball are awesome.

Money is important. It must be enough to support you in the off-season. Seriously consider how he will support himself. We have not given ours a nickel since the day he left. We have been very fortunate.

Mine approaches it that this is his dream, he loves to play, is young and now is the time. He can go to college when he's done. He was a good student, plus 1200 on the SAT's. Academics would not have been his priority.

I am a proponent of academics. This is a tough decision. It has to be one you and your family are comfortable with.

You will hear both sides of the argument, maybe from me, but definitely on this website. We approached the pro situation the same way we did colleges. Alot of info alot of questions. The decision may even be more difficult.

BobR,
You have received spectacular input from some of the best, most knowledgeable and thoughtful posters.
In terms of your son, I do think he needs your guidance on one element...it makes a difference what round he is chosen.
I hope justbaseball will not mind, but his son brings a different journey to the decision.
Erik was also a projected top pick in 2004 as a pitcher. He chose Stanford and went undrafted.
After his junior year, and some ups/downs along the journey, he was drafted in the 20th round.
He chose to return to Stanford for his senior year.
As you can see from posts on this site, from reading Baseball America, and other periodicals, he is having an absolutely spectacular season.
It is one of those story book type experiences that involves development, leadership, chemistry, bonding, and achievement.
What is occurring with Erik and his Stanford teammates this year will never occur in Milb.
It is unique to college baseball, and even then, unique to certain teams in any given year.
The players mentioned in this thread (njbb's son is a wonderfully talented middle infielder in the Royals organization who signed out of high school) are all tremendous players who took the journey in different ways. Each have been extremely successful to this point, but the success has some different methods of measurement.
Best of luck to your son and family in approaching the decision and in having some reassurance on the paths he has before him.

deldad,

I believe that you meant to say that your son and TPM's son were in the same HS draft year, right? A handful of ex-college players do make it to the bigs within a year out of college, but not many. Tim Linthicum of the Giants and Ross Detwiler of the Nats have, but Det is back at AAA or AA for the time being.


BobR,

For what it's worth, many years ago a college coach told me that his opinion was for a pitcher to go with the draft as opposed to going to college. Reason being is that the pros have made an investment in the player whereas the college pitcher is paid to win. The pros will protect their investment (especially if they have a lot of $$$ invested) and the college coach might overuse his players to get a win.

That's a bretty broad brush he was painting with and there are probably more exceptions to that statement than the truth. But it should at least give you a reason to investigate where your son might go to school. I think I have heard that the current coach at Virginia has never had a pitcher suffer a serious injury.

Since my guy is an '08 HSer,I only have the stories of others to relate. The previous posters in this thread are some of, if not the best HSBBW has to offer. Consider their input and experience.

...and a belated welcome to HSBBW.

After the pretty signing bonus what kind of salary does an average minor leaguer look at per month? I'm thinking of the guys that sign out of high school in the 7th or 8th round and on?
I'm trying to think of this in the frame of mind where how long will this bonus money last if you're living off of a minor league salary. Can you save some money if you're going to be in the minors for five years before you crack the big leagues, if at all?

Bob R;
For 25 years of International Baseball, I have the opportunity to observe the ability and character of 5,700 high school baseball players.

From Matt Williams to Bobby Jenks, each player has individual desires, motivation and tools which can assist in their climb to the Major Leagues.

Dave La Roche former ML pitcher, Jim Colborn former International Scouting Director and former ML pitcher, Jim Lentine former ML outfielder now a successful player agent and Tim Cossins, Marlins catching coach are a few of our coaches who have assisted in my evaluations of the 16-18 year old player.

Many players need the three years of college baseball to prepare their confidence.

However Torii Hunter, Derrick Lee, Bobby Jenks
and Jereme Bonderman were ready at 18 years of age. Why?

Each player has his own inner goals, fears and positive thoughts. This is "inner arrogance"

The body language and the player's "face" will describe his ability to battle against the odds.

Talk with your son as an advisor not as a parent.

Bob

I know minor league pay has increased I think it is $1100. But in my sons 1st year it was $850 mo gross during the season.
$400 mo went back to the team for room and board. There is also club house dues.... can't remenber for sure but it was about $10 to $15 per week.

BobR - These are some truly fantastic responses you are getting. I would have never had the benefit of knowing each of these possible stories and current outcomes (infielddad, no problem on sharing a little of Erik's story...like TPM's, deldad's, Fungo's and others, I think it is a story worth considering).

I will make one correction to infielddad's story though...an important one...he was drafted out of HS in a very late round but offered a fair amount of money. Its money he is very unlikely to see again unless he someday makes it to the big leagues. He does not regret it and is having the most fun of his life right now. He's also matured a great deal and has (I believe) a very good perspective on baseball and life in general. Some of that perspective was socked home to him with a stiff punch in the face!

It is impossible to predict the future and it is a personal choice that each player in this situation must make with his parent's guidance IMO.

I kind of resonated with this point in deldad's post:

quote:

He was a good student, plus 1200 on the SAT's. Academics would not have been his priority.

I have no doubt deldad's son will finish college someday if its important to him. Given his immense talent, I'm not sure it will be important at all from a financial standpoint. But assessing the maturity of your son and where his heart lies is pretty key IMO. From all reports, his son was both very mature (i.e. able to handle the stresses of MiLB) and determined to play pro ball right then and there. For them, I think their choice was every bit as good as the one we made.

This takes some very serious introspection and some 'nothing-goes-unsaid' parent/son discussions. And asking the types of questions that you have here. I like Fungo's list approach...its similar to our discussions about all of this.

I wish you the very best in sorting through all of this. Ask all the questions you want along the way! And once you've made the decision adjust to events as they present themselves, but don't look back and 2nd-guess your decision which I think is true of each and every story above. Good luck!

Deldad,
Absolutely no problem that's why I said that there would be differnet responses depending on the circumstances. Your son was projected much higher than mine and had a unique situation and I know from discussions it was well thought out. I also did state that mine was not willing to sign for 7th,8th round money at the time to give up college since most of it was being paid for. Maybe an earlier round may have made a difference.

Yes he is in High A, skipping low A, but there are many 2004's that are still in high A or some still in low A. My son has teammates drafted before him that are in High A and some the year after his HS draft year. That has a lot to do with how the organization views it's players and their skill level and position. Your son is extremely talented and his development is very important to his organization. Some of son's teammates came out of college hurt, some came out of HS hurt. That is something that no one has control over and no one really knows where they will be in one year, two years, three or four.

Yes your son's clock is way ahead of mine, but that really didn't seem to make a difference to him when he made his decision.

Sometimes it's really hard to see the other side without being on it.

Football games and college life was important in his decision and his college experience and instruction he received was supurb, one of the reasons he chose to head to college, as his High A pitching coach has told him, there is nothing he needs to learn but experience. That is also a consideration. Not sure if he would have chosen that path if he had been in someone else's charge. Plus he was looked after carefully and left college healthy.

The milb pay has increased plus I think a monthly bonus from his organization (100 dollars). However, here in South Florida in High A rent is out of site and so is food. You cannot think that you can save anything on it. I think his club dues are 20 or 25 per check, plus tips to do extra laundry . Most of the players are living 4-5 in an apartment on air matresses, mine was living in a hotel, but one of the guys already moved up and he got in a house with two others who also didn't want to live with 4-5,6. Some of the local kids went home to live, as my son may do when we move closer to the field. He was fortunate to get a good bonus so that it doesn't hurt as much, but some of the lower picks are hurting and my son has even given up cleats and turf shoes, sliders, etc. for those who can't afford them.

Those are some things one needs to think about.

As mentioned by everyone, it is something that needs serious discussion and I advise that you do discuss it asap and let your son decide based on info given. Sometimes, IMO, they don't understand all that is involved, the lure of pro ball is so strong that is the only thing on their mind.

I'm not usually the one saying this, but...

This thread needs to go Golden, don't you think?



Julie

BobR-TPM and Justbaseball make some great points. Another comparison, is the route Justbaseball's son took. Again he was in the same draft class as TPM's son and mine, and also faced some obstacles.

Justbaseball's advice about the nothing left unsaid conversation is awesome. We had the come to Jesus meeting, and nothing was left unsaid. Even involved the little brother who was 10, because there can be no regrets. No second thoughts. No I told you so's. Make sure he understands your priorities, make sure you listen to his, advise, counsel, prod, but remember in the end it is his decision. One of my fears was that if I talked him into going to college, and something else happened, would he look at me for the rest of my life and think, it was my fault. Now one of my fears is that something happens, and he looks at me for the rest of his life and thinks why didn't you make me go to college. Luckily, and I use that word every time I talk on this subject because there is no right and no wrong, it has worked out, so far.

The other issue is the myopic view of a parent. I thank justbaseball and tpm for the compliments of my son's talent, but I still see him as that kid who never put the cap back on the toothpaste and who's room was a disaster area. It is important that you reach out and get as many opinions, honest opinions, as possible. Advisors, scouts, coaches, ex-players, any and all whether you like them or not.

Faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. Hebrews 11-1

Good luck

NJBB's son also was in our son's HS draft year.

Four players, four different situations. What may have been good for one, may not have been good for another. That's why it is so difficult to ask and base decisions on the answers given.

The most important thing, whatever the decision by the player, he must be happy with it and NEVER look back. Some good advice given to son from a professional at the time, if you suddenly found yourself regretting your decision, where would you rather be when regretting it? He never regretted the decison he made, not once (though maybe he thought about it), so for him, it was a good choice.

quote:

Originally posted by MN-Mom:
I'm not usually the one saying this, but...

This thread needs to go Golden, don't you think?



Julie

Julie, I don't think you ever need a second, but just in case, I second your thoughts. A truly fascinating discussion of a fascinating topic, by the best posters, posting their best, uh, except for the lawyer guy who missed ED's draft round in 2004.

Bob R.:
Welcome to this site! I think you have been treated to a perfect illustration of what makes this site so incredible.

Imagine! In front of Bob and his son and family is one of the most important decisions they will ever make, and in the space of a few hours, they are able to consider the experiences of several people who have faces the very same decision, and are able and willing to share honestly all the facets on both sides, from direct personal experience.

Priceless!