If you want to be drafted, you do it according to the rules of MLB and any modifications from the collective bargaining agreement. MLB has an antitrust exemption. They can do things others cannot.
Man, if that isn't a cold, slap in the face, I don't know what is. I would rather deal in truth than fantasy infielddad so your perspective is appreciated.
It's kind of like the old joke, "Why do Rock Stars date Super Models?" Because they can. MLB does what it does because it can. There is no minor league union or what not to balance things so what we have is the equivalent of a Vietnamese sweat shop. Not saying the unions are a panacea - just using them as an example of leverage that does not exist at the minor league level. The only leverage is talent and that may not even be enough sometimes.
You know what, you are right infielddad, this is a good thread.
Understand the rules, how they are played and all of the implications, whether you sign to play pro ball or go to college. Once you make up your mind, it's not a thing that can be so easily changed in 6 months.
Just that we keep saying, it's not how it works and life coach just not getting it.
Posts: 11036 | Location: South Florida | Registered: July 28, 2003
I would rather deal in truth than fantasy infielddad so your perspective is appreciated.
CD, I actually find the fantasy aspect a lot more fun. It just seems like the more I look for fantasy in Milb, the more I run into reality. With that said, when I watch and talk with our son about his rehab, I realize the intensity with which young men pursue a dream/fantasy in what can be a very tough minded business.
'You don't have to be a great player to play in the major leagues, you've got to be a good one every day.'
Posts: 2092 | Location: ca | Registered: February 11, 2003
it's not how it works and life coach just not getting it.
TPM I get it ; its the person who is claiming what I described as the case that doesn't. I like to deal with facts too and that's why I presented this situation in a thread here. I knew I would get great input from some very knowledgable posters. In fact IFdad's posts have enlightened me even more. Isn't that the purpose of the HSBBWEB? Please forgive me if I am wrong.
Posts: 18 | Location: estn usa | Registered: July 06, 2005
infielddad i may be wrong but if that boy is out of mlb,after 3 weeks or a season he can still play college ball? maybe not d1? there is a ncaa rule that allows players that don't make it in the minors to play in college. i believe they need to pay back some money? not 100% sure.and if he only lasted a short time he may not have recieved his signing bonus,only some per diem money.
i think if the original player in this question leaves school ,he is a free agent? probably won't get much money if any to sign.this may be worth looking into.
my son signed a contract in june ,needed tommy john so the team voided his contract. now he can sign as a free agent or go to school and play. the team he was with had dozens of free agents in camp.keep in mind only usa college and high school kids get drafted,the rest of the world are free agents. i didn't realize this either.
"i'm a light eater,when it's light out....i eat." Tommy John
Posts: 1675 | Location: new hampshire | Registered: March 25, 2003
Two questions that may have already been answered: When my son was drafted out of high school he was asked to sign a “redraft agreement”. If I remember correctly, this assured the club that signed him first right of refusal the next time he became draft eligible. Anyone know what the “re-draft agreement” is?
What if the player completely withdrew from a D-1 college, when would he be eligible to sign?
Posts: 4965 | Location: Spring Creek (Jackson),Tennessee | Registered: December 26, 2002
good topic - shows the importance of clearly understanding your options when making important decisions
quote:
by 20dad: i think if the original player in this question leaves school,he is a free agent?
if (US citizen) he was drafted out of hs there is no action HE can take to make himself a free agent - - any event causing him to become a free agent would come from mlb ... contract voided, contract not tendered, or going undrafted in next eligeble draft.
think about it, the draft would be useless if a top drafted player (or any player) could cause himself to be allowed to negotiate with 30 teams instead of 1
fungo et all - redraft agreement ... a team can't redraft a player they had previously drafted and NOT signed without player's OK ... so it's not a first right of refusal as the player could be be picked by another team before the redraft team gets their chance
Posts: 3625 | Location: NE Ohio | Registered: December 27, 2002
by fungo: What if the player completely withdrew from a D-1 college, when would he be eligible to sign?
with who? the drafting team lost rights when he attended class - not temporarily, but forever
someone in his situation needs accurate advice on when his next draft chance is & what steps must be taken ie; transfer JC, drop out & hardship petition mlb, etc
free-agency is not in the forecast
Posts: 3625 | Location: NE Ohio | Registered: December 27, 2002
**found this on Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MLB_Draft A club generally retains the rights to sign a selected player for one week prior to the next draft, or until the player enters, or returns to, a four-year college on a full-time basis. A selected player who enters a junior college cannot be signed until the conclusion of the school's baseball season. A player who is drafted and does not sign with the club that selected him may be drafted again at a future year's draft, so long as the player is eligible for that year's draft. A club may not select a player again in a subsequent year, unless the player has consented to the re-selection.
A player who is eligible to be selected and is passed over by every club becomes a free agent and may sign with any club, up until one week before the next draft, or until the player enters, or returns to, a four-year college full-time or enters, or returns to, a junior college. In the one-week period before any draft, which is called the "closed period", the general rule is that no club may sign a new player.
This description is a general one and the Major League Baseball Rules themselves, not this summary, govern eligibility issues. Players and coaches with questions about particular players are referred to the Baseball Operations Department at the Office of the Commissioner of Baseball.
infielddad i may be wrong but if that boy is out of mlb,after 3 weeks or a season he can still play college ball? maybe not d1? there is a ncaa rule that allows players that don't make it in the minors to play in college. i believe they need to pay back some money? not 100% sure.and if he only lasted a short time he may not have recieved his signing bonus,only some per diem money.
20s, there is a big difference between players who do not make it in the minors and a player who signs a contract and does not want to play. In the former, the players were "released" by their club/contract. I understand they can play DII/DIII in some situations, after being released by the ML club. In the situation I described, the team is not voiding the contract or releasing the player from it. The ML team says the contract is signed and if the young man wishes to play baseball, it will be under that contract. The common theme in each situtation is that once you sign a ML contract, you play with that team until you are relased or the contrac voided by the team. I agree with Bee. MLB does not want players to find "loopholes" in the draft process. Players cannot cotrol the process by dropping out of school and the like.
'You don't have to be a great player to play in the major leagues, you've got to be a good one every day.'
Posts: 2092 | Location: ca | Registered: February 11, 2003
MLB does not want players to find "loopholes" in the draft process. Players cannot cotrol the process by dropping out of school and the like
Are there loop holes??
I'm just bringing it up for thought.
I'm with TPM, Why would you not finish what you started at College. You made your choice.
It just seem's like a waste of time for a player, to wait for the next draft, Rather than talking to the Original club that drafted them, And work out a deal?? Just food for thought. EH
Posts: 2494 | Location: northern california | Registered: December 17, 2005
I read some where that it a drafted player who drops out of 4 yr college has to get permission from the baseball commissoner to reenter the next yrs draft. Scott Boras would have all his top players drafted, attend college, drop out and become free agents,
Posts: 1193 | Location: NJ | Registered: December 30, 2002
It just seem's like a waste of time for a player, to wait for the next draft, Rather than talking to the Original club that drafted them, And work out a deal?? Just food for thought.
EH, the reason that cannot happen is MLB draft rules prevent it from happening. If there was any question, now it is even more clear. With the new CBA, if a drafted player is not signed by 8/15 following the draft, they lose the right to sign whether they go to a 4 year college, a JC, or choose not to attend college. In the world of professional baseball, being a free agent is usually a very valuable position. It allows the player to negotiate with every club, not just one. Because of that, MLB requires players(US citizens and a few others) to "earn" free agency status. Since MLB is paying the money, they, rightfully, control to whom and how it gets paid in every situation they can anticipate and the draft is one of those. Think of it this way. If Scott Boras, or any other agent represented any #1 pick who was a high school player, they would hold that player out and not have him sign by 8/15...if he could then have that player declared a free agent. That will not happen. While I appreciate you are looking at what is best for the player or a "waste" of time and talent of a player, that isn't much of a factor when MLB establishes the draft and signing rules.
'You don't have to be a great player to play in the major leagues, you've got to be a good one every day.'
Posts: 2092 | Location: ca | Registered: February 11, 2003
WOW, can you imagine what would go on if there were no rules?
Drafted player decides to go to school, after one semester, realizes school is not for him and he might not start. Wants drafting team to take him back.
Drafted player decides to sign, after a few weeks decides this is not what he thought it would be, wants out of contract and wants to go to college that he signed his NLI with.
I don't know the rules, I wouldn't expect everyone here to know them either. That's why if going pro and giving up college is a very big consideration, an advisor can explain all the rules and implications for final decisions.
Posts: 11036 | Location: South Florida | Registered: July 28, 2003
by ifdad: I appreciate you are looking at what is best for the player or a "waste" of time and talent of a player
isn't losing signing rights at a deadline (8/15 or attending class) protecting the player?? the club has a finite time period to present their best offer or risk losing the player & wasting that pick - that's in the players best interest, not in his best interest is entering college & then having the team present their "offer of the week" as time drags on
here the player WAS protected by the system - in effect he told the team "no thanks" and walked away without thinking much ...
some folks should just hit their thumb with a hammer
Posts: 3625 | Location: NE Ohio | Registered: December 27, 2002
Bee, to the extent the new deadline forces earlier decisions, that can work to the benefit of the player. However, if the player isn't signed and goes to a 4 year school, he isn't eligible to be drafted until age 21 or after his junior year. The team that did not sign him gets to repeat that pick in next draft plus their regular pick for that draft. Just my view, but, on its face, I think this gives the team a bit more leverage than it does the player. In the past the team would waste the pick if the player did not sign. Now, the team gets additional picks the following year for players not signed. In general, I think we are talking about a very small percentage of players. The number who signed out of high school and decided they hated it and wanted to "void" the contract does not seem to be many. The number who don't sign and end up "unhappily" in college does not seem to be many. This may change some with the removal of the draft/follow for the JC option. I do think this thread shows how complicated things can be and why every player who has these types of options out of high school can use the benefit of very good and comprehensive information or an extremely good advisor.
'You don't have to be a great player to play in the major leagues, you've got to be a good one every day.'
Posts: 2092 | Location: ca | Registered: February 11, 2003
infielddad your right two different things, i'm sorry .i read this a little different with my morning eye's.didn't mean to confuse or give bad advice. again oops.
"i'm a light eater,when it's light out....i eat." Tommy John
Posts: 1675 | Location: new hampshire | Registered: March 25, 2003
In rereading some of my posts in this thread, I feel as though I came off too critical and a bit like a jerk. My apologies. I think there is a lot of good and relevent input and information from multiple sources in this thread. I hope my comments didn't diminish that information.
'You don't have to be a great player to play in the major leagues, you've got to be a good one every day.'
Posts: 2092 | Location: ca | Registered: February 11, 2003
It just seems like the more I look for fantasy in Milb, the more I run into reality. 
; its the person who is claiming what I described as the case that doesn't. I like to deal with facts too and that's why I presented this situation in a thread here. I knew I would get great input from some very knowledgable posters. In fact IFdad's posts have enlightened me even more. Isn't that the purpose of the HSBBWEB? Please forgive me if I am wrong.
, it seems very confusing! and interesting...the player may write the commissioner for an appeal...but...???
