quote:

who is going to make the team, the kid that plays a sport year round for 5 years and is polished? Or the kid that plays rec only and is way behind the other kids that play year round?

Doug whos opinion is this?

One of my friends who is in the MLB says his hockey training helped him more than anything else. Most BB guys ll sports help the overall conditioning and coordination. At some point and that is well beyond 12 yo dropping a sport or 2 to focus on BB may be a wise thing to do. Mainly because of injury potential.
It is sounding like a lot of parents they see their son as better than the other guy. Maybe he is but more than likely he isn't. Antway at 12 they are just developing and what is true today won't be true in a year or two.

I had an interesting conversation with my son the other day.He believes that he became a good short stop because he never received infield instruction until he went pro. He just developed his own natural ability which he feels gave him an advantage over players who were taught the mechanics at a young age.

So it was to his advantage not to become a polished player until he was older.
He also played s****r in the fall and winter which developed speed and agility.

I have been following this post and along with Doc am completely confused!

Donutman,
I understand your reasons for concern, you are not alone. There are many parents in the US who are in the same situation. With a booming young population and our communities bulding less and less schools to put them in, it's very difficult to find a spot on a HS baseball roster where the student population is 25-3000K with only a few spots available. Therefore we try to do everything we can to give out kids an "edge" before they arrive to their destination(HS or beyond).

I won't give you advice as to switching teams as you have gotten enough of that, and some very good thoughts to ponder about the decision.

Interesting, but after reading this I did a search and last year in Arizona, BA only listed 32 prospects from the state, mostly from the univerities and Juco's. So I am wondering if those 100-120 games at 13 later translates to burnout, injuries or just not playing really good baseball to develop the fundamentals when players are young. BTW, I live in a state of year round baseball, and not sure if this is the norm, but it wasn't when son was younger.

At 8-9 mine loved to pitch, at 10-11 he loved third base, at 11-12 catching, at 13-14, outfield, at 15-16 ss, then he didn't have a choice anymore. The best part of it, was that he very oten played on teams when he was younger where everyone played and learned different positions. That's what you do, IMO at 11,12,13,14. It's quite amazing how unlikley the LL ss will most likely not be a ss in HS, college or maybe as a pro. Things change, kids change, circumstances change. I know that you made it clear your son would be available to play where needed, and it's frustrating that he is not playing where he wants to play. I know that feeling.

Polished players rarely make it over natural talent, so if your son has a lot of that, you need not worry. Naturally talented players have the ability, because of their athleticism to play just about any position when given the opportunity if doesn't matter how much they do or don't play when younger. Fungo made a great point, in college you will find players on a team that come from all over the country, not just the ones who played year round ball. They got the opportunity because of who they are, not where they came from.

In conclusion I will just add one opinion, I would be more concerned with the 100+ games a year than position at this time, but, that is just my opinion.

njbb post brings to mind something that Zach Dukes' dad (One player's Pop)told me once, his son, now a MLB pitcher, learned to pitch by throwing to a target painted on the side of their barn. I do beleive he many have gotten to where he is on his natural ability, not because he was "polished" when he was drafted in HS.

Doughnutman,
I'm going to weigh in here, because I have a son who is a couple of years older, and who has played in two different large travel baseball programs. So I have had the opportunity to watch the progress of dozens of players. The baseball season here is quite literally year-round-- the weather is almost always suitable for play. Like Phoenix, it is a large metropolitan area, with typically large high schools. Finally, my experience is recent.

It was a surprise to me, but it turns out that players who only play baseball and no other sport are at a significant disadvantage in making the HS freshman team. In fact, I only know of one player who solely played baseball at age 13 and who was subsequently able to make his freshman team.

I believe there are several reasons behind this. Bear in mind that of the players trying out for the team, only a handful are clear standouts. The rest of the prospective players are not easily distinguished from each other on the basis of performance at tryouts. So the coaches look at other perceived factors, which include athletic ability, competitive fire, and willingness to contribute to a team effort. Successful participation in any sport in addition to baseball is a strong indicator of the first two of those factors, and team sports imply the third. Conversely, there is a risk that a player who has specialized in baseball may have carefully polished a lesser talent, and thus has a limited horizon.

And that horizon matters. While a freshman team should be trying to win, the primary purpose of the freshman program is to identify and develop those players who can contribute to the varsity team in a year or two.

I think there is one other reason, unrelated to coach's perceptions. Simply put, participation in other sports enhances and develops athletic ability. The payback in playing the 60th through 100th baseball game is relatively low. The time would be better spent on 10 weekends playing basketball or s****r, and gaining speed, endurance, ability to see the entire field, as well as quick reactions. Yes, travel ball coaches will allow it. I've been close to several youth teams which were ranked nationally in the top ten (by whomever bothers with this stuff),and all of the players participated in at least one other sport.

Nope, not going to let this thread die a quiet death. Gonna ride this horse 'till it's beat into the ground.

I've talked to high school baseball coaches that I know and they love kids that have played multiple sports. For the most part a kid's not going to get fast by playing or practicing baseball. Basketball, s****r, hockey, or track will do a better job at that. And IMO football is a great teacher of mental toughness.

I had a kid in spring ball who I'd known since he was 7 or 8. At that age he had average speed, nothing really spectacular. He hadn't played baseball in a couple of years so he was initialy rather unpolished. But he'd been playing basketball and running track, and he is now seriously FAST. His work ethic is second to none, I showed him a video of his swing and gave him a couple of things to work on and within two weeks he'd fixed those things. Same thing with his throwing. He got selected for our park's all-star team which won the state championship this summer.

Here in Florida, middle schools do not play baseball. My son played s****r and volleyball and played baseball a few times a week on a league which was not a rec league.
By the time he reached HS baseball became his main focus, playing on a team in fall and some summers and then his regular 28 game HS season. I am not sure if that would even total 100 games on an annual basis between fall, spring and summer (maybe his junior year).
I do beleive his participation in other sports did help him as an athlete and essentially in the end, that counts very much into the equation of their success.

There is no need to belittle a poster because he/she beleives what they are doing is the right thing. It is our job to assist in their questions if asked, without getting nasty. JMO.

quote:

Originally posted by Doughnutman:
Does anybody else have any sugeestions? Winning is great, but he has 2 years left before HS and he needs more infield time in my opinion. A ball player needs all the skills he can get.

Have him watch this:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=KC9AKY5_4ek

I'll bet this kid wanted more infield time at some point. Then he did this in HS on national TV. Somewhere along the way he prepared to be the best he could at whatever position he was playing. It paid off.

If he remains in the outfield have him look at kids like this, and folks like Jacoby Ellsbury of the Red Sox. Another very talented player who probably wanted to be in the most visible positions at one time or another. Now he's stuck out in the outfield in a World Series and is loved by Red Sox fans.

It's all in how you, or your parents, look at it.

TM

What started out as a simple question of switching teams or not has turned into a Nature vs Nurture debate. Since you can't change the Nature part (we'll leave steroids out of this) then the discussion should be just on the Nurture part. And we focus on baseball - then Doughnut man's son should be put in an environment where he can develop skills at SS or any other positions he desires.

HS evaluations will focus on the 5 baseball tools. If your son is weak in any of those areas they should be identified and a plan should be developed to develop those skills or to strengthen physical weaknesses. This could be accomplished by playing another sport or doing specific physical training for speed/strength/agility.

My last bit of advice ( I know, few people read these boards for actual advice) is to try and use analytical thinking. There are a ton of post that start " I know a kid..." and go on to describe unlikely events that occurred. So what? Usually these are abnormalities rather than the norm. How can any conclusions be drawn for specific incidences? You would need controlled studies to gather data and then analyze results.

Just use common sense and keep playing baseball as long as you're all enjoying it. Enjoy the ride, wherever it takes you.