Simply put ....There are pros and cons to both (as w/ anything in life).....educate yourself as much a possible and make a decision.....Obviously the college coaches want you to go to school and the pro guys want you to play pro ball.........Each situation is different and unique.......I guess I'm up in arms about people trying to sway someone they have never met to make a major life decision......I feel this is not the place to get advice on wheather one should decide to play pro or college baseball.......maybe I'm wrong, and I do understand the passion that goes into the advice but I just do not feel this is the place based on each unique case......

If you want to go to college and play then go to college and play.....

If you want to play professional baseball then play professional baseball.....

Come up w/ a $$ figure and stick to it......It's the kid who has to go to school or play pro ball and no one else......

That's LIFE....Don't get a headache about it....If you are in that postion to make a decision you are very fortunate......

I DO NOT MEAN TO OFFEND ANYONE>>>>>>>>

quote:

I feel this is not the place to get advice on wheather one should decide to play pro or college baseball

SAY WHAT!!!
I think this is the best place in the world to get that advice. This is the only place that I know of where you can hear it from those players (and their parents) that have gone to college out of high school AND those that have turned pro from high school. In order to weigh options one needs to gather information. Infielddad gives a very accurate description of the highs and lows of minor league baseball. His son had to make some very important decisions about college and about professional baseball and he has shared those decisions over the years. I appreciate the experiences shared by those that had traveled the path before me. Obviously you feel that sharing opinions are good or you wouldn't have posted yours on this topic ----- you said it very well and I happen to agree with when you said:

quote:

If you want to go to college and play then go to college and play.....

If you want to play professional baseball then play professional baseball.....

Come up w/ a $$ figure and stick to it......It's the kid who has to go to school or play pro ball and no one else......

That's LIFE....Don't get a headache about it....If you are in that postion to make a decision you are very fortunate......

LOW337, Your suggestion and contribution to this topic could help a young player or his parents make a very important decision? We need to keep talking and giving our opinions so our sons can make the best choices. That is the soul of the HSBBW.
Thanks,
Fungo

This is definately a place to come for advice, read different ideas and stories and look for answers. You can get a different perspective or piece of information that you would have never had just pondering the question on your own. However, just because one person says something does not make it true or accurate for your particular situation.

It's up to each of us to to be intelligent and read, do research and then apply the gathered information to each of our own unique situations.

Low - I didn't really think this thread was about choosing between college and pro ball. I thought InfieldDad and our other parents of drafted players were sharing their son's realities of playing ball in the minor leagues. I appreciate hearing about their stories.

I do still feel like they are blessed. I think those players are blessed to have an opportunity that very few have. Do I think they live blessed lives every day? No - it's obviously a very hard road. It's a road that any parent could understand them giving up and I would suspect some parents would be happy if they gave it up and didn't put themselves through the particular challenges day after day.

Again, I've enjoyed hearing the boy's stories and continue to cheer for each and every one of our HSBBW boys as they try to move up!

Low - this is a wonderful place to gain insight into people and baseball.

I don't have a headache about my sons decision to go pro out of high school. just trying to provide a little insight.
I have to admit to headaches during hitting slumps

nj....If he wasn't a prospect, with his offensive numbers this year, he would've been "launched" already. Key will be the end of the year...was last year atypical (an aberration) or was this year more typical, offensively.

I have to agree with Fungo.
This is absolutely the place for Parent's and player's to discuss there concern's.
It really help's a lot to hear other Individual's Concern's and decision making.
Most everybody has a good idea of what there thinking of doing but it help's to have your concern's discussed by other's.
EH

Infielddad's post was awesome and right on.

OK OK OK......My main beef was w/ a few people really leaning one way when giving opinions as advice.

Let's try this:
Pro Ball "Pros":

1. get payed to play (perhaps large bonus)
2. more games which provide more opportunity to develop. 68 - 76 games in short season. 140 games full season
3. professional instruction (position specific)
4. can get school package (there are stipulations)
etc...

Pro Ball "Cons":

1. potentially nine months away from home
2. the grind (often you will not know what day it is)
3. if signed for little or no bonus you must produce or be able to help develop others or you get fired (released)
4. the longer you wait to go back to school to get degree the more apt you are not to go back at all.
5. risk of injury

College "Pros":

1. progress towards a degree (we hope)
2. college experience (possible summer league experience as well)
3. may have ability to get home to see family
4. hopefully some school is paid for


College "Cons":

1. too few games played (intra squad in fall, 56 in spring) some vary, i'm referring to D-I.
2. often you don't get position specific instruction nor quaility instruction.
3. Coach or someone important to you on the staff could leave. (could affect scholarship)
4. risk of injury

My feeling is you can go back and forth as to what is a better choice. But it is all relative.

You must come up w/ a $$ figure and stick to it.
It may be: 20K , 100K, 300K, 800K, 1Mil, 3Mil.
That is up to the player/family. How much is 3 to 4 years of school worth to you.

And yes the more money a pro team has in you, the more chances you will get. They want their investment to succeed or help them obtain talent.

Hope it helps.

And yes I realize that I meant to put this in the Pro vs College Forum....

Just pretend that's where are right now....

Low337,
I can understand how your post and views relate to the thread in About the Draft and the debate about what to do if your son is drafted in the first round and offered first round money. Lots of advice being given there. Seems to be a fair amount of "disinformation" included in some of that advice.
I don't think anyone in this thread is offering any advice on college vs pro.

Beenthere,
I have a very opposite view on your post.
For a high school player drafted in the first 10 rounds, I would think the Royals are going to be extremely patient. They have completely changed the approach offensively and you would have to think the Royals feel confident Chris has the ability to make those adjustments and be even more successful once he is comfortable with them. If Chris were perhaps a senior sign out of college, the timetable and expectations might be quite different. I don't think Chris needs to put any pressure on himself over the last few months of the season and don't think there is any reasonable chance he will be "launched."
I have an awful lot of respect for the scouting opinions of bbscout. I remember his posts after the Fall instructional league. He reported he loved what he saw in Chris as a player. I feel comfortable that is a shared judgement among those who make those decisions.

Excellent Post LOW337!!!! I have refrained from posting in this thread expressing my opinion but here it goes.

Some very valid and good points came out of that last post. The main one was, "come up with a figure and stick with it"-LOW in pre-draft agreement.
Don't get greedy and miss your opportunity.

The one part of my experience personally after signing in the "PROS" pointed out in LOW's post was the instruction received on a more individual basis, daily.

In college, it was much different and we all seemed to train as unit or team most times with the same practice schedule and routine, most days. Infield/outfield practice, cages, tee-areas, batting practice on field...well, you know the drill.

In the professional level, the coaches were always making suggestions, doing advanced drills, helping in cages, and breaking down each individual's mechanics in order to make adjustments and corrections. Teammates were always helping and teaching through experiences. This was empirical and made the difference for many.

Through the years of observing pro teams in the leagues I've covered, I have found that each organization does take pride and works very hard to bring out maximum potential of players.
Each organization does keep putting player back out there until the player does one of two things: makes necessary adjustments and excels or fails and falls flat on his face in pro ball. Some just can't make it at this level, whether it be because of injuries, or level of competition. Those are the harsh realities of success or failure in the business aspects of baseball at the highest level.

LOW337 did point something out that is sooo right about the amount of money invested in player. I fell victim to this harsh reality in the business aspects of who gets released myself! I have seen this happen O too many times! Top picks are given many more chances than lower picks. Unfortunately, that's just the business of investments of property.

Look at it this way, the odds of your son signing a professional contract are about one in a 100,000 each year according to statistics of draft eligible candidates. You have accomplished a major feat in the simple fact of defying the odds of being signed at all, and yes YOU ARE BLESSED! IMHO, I think what I'm hearing is the harsh realities in this thread of players personal experiences, which there are a lot more who don't succeed in pro ball than do. I didn't succeed, but Im thankful to have experienced the opportunity because a 100,000 others the year I signed didn't!! At least when you're done, you can look back and know you have done everything possible to achieve your dream. LOW made it much further than I and is an excellent scout, instructor, coach and has played with and against the best of them and we can draw a great deal from his experiences! Collectively, I just don't think we should portray pro baseball as a dreadful experience here at HSBBW messageboard because so many parents and HS age prospects will have an ill-conceived outlook which may hinder his progress to attain goal of being chosen to play by professional scouts. It's all about the DREAM. Lets not deprive a young man of at least getting through the first hurdle by painting an ugly picture! peace, Shep

quote:

Unfortunately, that's just the business of investments of property.

Shep,
That is exactly the point I made. In the world of professional baseball, the players are viewed as "investments of property." I am not expressing opinons on whether that is good or bad. I merely pointed out it is a reality and one every parent and player needs to appreciate when they sign a professional contract.

"It's all about the DREAM. Lets not deprive a young man of at least getting through the first hurdle by painting an ugly picture!"


There really isn't any effort in this thread to paint a picture other than reality. Our son has had the exhilaration of being drafted. To this day, the scout who signed him talks of how profoundly the scout was affected when that occured because it meant so much. If I had my way, I wish he could relive that day one million times. Rather than deprive anyone of that dream, I encourage every player and parent to believe that dream can come, if you work hard enough, are good enough, and get a little lucky along the way.
Our son has overcome obstacles and had great and wonderful experiences including being selected for an All Star game where everyone knew he was the very last player selected for an assignment in April.
On the field, he loves and cherishes every minute of what he does.
I am sorry if some of the off the field elements are interpreted as "ugly."
I don't think they are "ugly." They are some of the facts of life for that "person/player" who is referred to rather matter of factly as an "investment of property."

Infielddad & Others,

I just wanted to say thank you.

I never knew what it was really like in pro ball until I started reading this site and probably will never truly understand the full scope of it. I hate to say it, but a lot of these kids and us parents too, some times have these fairy tale ideas of what it will be like and how it will turn out.

We all want a happy ending for our sons. Maybe, for a lucky few it will come true. But at least these kids will be a little more prepared for the reality of what lies a head with the help of HSBBW.

Good Post Infielddad but I do have rebutttal

Look at the title you gave this thread>Still want to play professional baseball???????

Maybe it's just me, but I interpret that as to say, be careful what you ask for because you just might get and not like it! If I were a 15-17 yr old reading some of the negative overtones in this thread about pro baseball I may change my direction to pursue golf or some other sport instead All joking aside, you know me well enough Mr A to know I personally wouldn't do that, but some aren't as determined as others, like me. Nothing can take me away from my dreams and/or aspirations and my attitude of intestinal fortitude until I have exhausted every possibility and then I still won't give up! Now that's just me.

On this board for example. Decisions can be swayed with just a little negativity for a teenager already fighting puberty with so much temptation all around them pulling them in other directions. Parents may even persuade alternate routes for their sons after reading some of this causing me and LOW and others to miss out on the next Major League player

On the other hand, I really have enjoyed the posts in this thread and do also think the truth should be told from true to life experiences and that's what I meant when I said last night, I will not lie! The truth should be told about the business of professional baseball so the prospect can prepare better and know what to expect. I really enjoyed fungo's post early this morning and put a great deal of thought in what he said, "I think this is the best place in the world to get advice"-Fungo

In defense of LOW337, what I think he meant, and I may be wrong, is something entirely different than fungo responded to...This is what I think LOW meant> sitting down and speaking with an individual who represents a college or pro team to get a feel for exactly what's expected, how much money and what the player will get in return, is more suited than basing decisions off messageboard of disgruntled parents and players who feel their dream not reaching fruition. Well, it happened to bubandbran, Oldpitcher, me, LOW, beenthere and a host of others here on this site in our pro playing careers too but I'm not going to discourage others from at least getting the same chance I got by questioning my own personal decision to play pro ball because it didn't work out. In other words, go over a few things with recruiter, face to face, with all the realities beforehand in order to make decision.

This board is an excellent venue for so many areas involving the big picture and is a good place to get feedback and a dose of reality, for sure. Peace, and you are all my heroes! Shep

Great idea making this thread Golden

To me, knowledge is power. Thus, I view this thread in a positive light. I didn't see anywhere that it was suggested that in hindsight that playing pro baseball was "possibly" not a good idea. What I take from it is this:

If your son should happen to be drafted someday, of course celebrate the achievement. Before sending them off and over time, you can fill them in on some of these "realities" so they have some mental background for the difficulties that lie ahead and to know they are not alone. I believe someone who knows ahead of time about some of these difficulties may be better equipped to deal with the grind than someone that discovers these things on their own. I am sure that some of these things are tough to deal with regardless if you know the score beforehand or not.

Here is a little anecdote I heard from Jack Nicholas many years ago and it goes toward his mental toughness. He said he was in a golf tournament playoff with 3 others where there were ominous weather signs like dark skies, rain, hail, thunder and even some lightning in the distance. Each of the other three golfers in the playoff kept looking at the skies and saying out loud "Surely, they will postpone this until tomorrow, how could anyone possibly play under these conditions" All the while he on the other hand went about his business taking his practice swings and prayed inside they would make them play it out right then and there for he knew that he already had them beat mentally. They never postponed the playoff and he said it was the easiest playoff win in his career.

I imagine times are tough for every player at the next level. When the bus rides become a grind, the pay is not adequate to pay your bills, your employer gives you no respect, and there is constant fear of losing your job, use these hardships to mentally get one up on the next guy who may just be thinking to themselves "How could anyone possibly play under these conditions?"

Great job to all.....

quote:

On this board for example. Decisions can be swayed with just a little negativity for a teenager already fighting puberty with so much temptation all around them pulling them in other directions. Parents may even persuade alternate routes for their sons after reading some of this causing me and LOW and others to miss out on the next Major League player

Shep,
you know the baseball business lots better than I do.
I will state that, from what little I know, the players who "might be swayed" from a little reality, or "negativity" to use your term had better be an amazing talent. If this type of player is not an amazing talent, the type of mindset where they can be easily swayed means they may not love the game enough, have the passion to succeed, or the mental stamina to deal with life in the minor leagues in any event. They better be really good or they are not going to make it anyway and may well not even if they are amazing talents.
If there are universal traits in the minor league players I have met, the two most apparent are wonderful talent and mental strength/dedication second to none.
If a major league team were looking to invest $1,000,000 or more in someone who was swayed by my postings on this site, maybe I will have done them a service that all the predraft interviews and tests would not have noted. . But, I don't think so.

Wow, many excellent posts in this thread!

As an aside, I figured out how to move the whole thing to the Golden Threads forum, but still keep a shortcut (post with a little blue arrow) in the Going Pro forum where it originated. Ha, I am still figuring out some of these things, after more than a year.

Julie