quote:

Originally posted by 3FingeredGlove:
...I suspect Dash will find a different phrase in the future...

Count on it.

quote:

Originally posted by 3FingeredGlove:

quote:

Originally posted by cccsdad:
Look, I don't want to be "THAT GUY" ...

Well, from where I sit, it looks like you are "that guy".

Dash made reference to "invisible umpires", and Jimmy03 interpreted it differently than Dash meant. They have cleared up the misunderstanding, and I suspect Dash will find a different phrase in the future, but you continue to comment about which of them "missed the point."

It looks to me like you just want to argue, even if you don't have a dog in the fight. I'd appreciate if you could ease up a little.

Dash made his comment with the assumption we all had a pretty good understanding of the dynamics of a baseball game and how it's managed by umpires.

The initial response to dash's post was insinuating that an umpire in order to do his job, has to be making calls that pi$$ people off. I maintain those calls will happen and they are part of the game, I do not however, concede that a game without those types of calls is one in which the official must not have done his job.

As far as your "dog in the race" comment, you might want to see who started this thread.

Not only do I have a "dog in the race", it's my racetrack. I also find it amusing, when I give my opinion, and don't back down, I'm being "that guy" and arguing or complaining, yet I don't see the same standard being used when others in here, argue their point with just as much passion.

So to quote YOU

quote:

I'd appreciate if YOU could ease up a little.

Just a point of clarification. Two times in this thread reference was made to runners being assisted by base coaches after hitting balls over the fence for home runs. One was in dash's original post and the other referred to Mark McGwire's 62nd home run. Both suggested that the runners could have been called out for being assisted.

That particular violation (runner assisted by a base coach) only applies during a live ball. When the batted balls in those cases passed over the fence for a home run the ball became dead. In neither case could those B/R's be called out for being assisted by a base coach.

quote:

Originally posted by pilsner:
Just a point of clarification. Two times in this thread reference was made to runners being assisted by base coaches after hitting balls over the fence for home runs. One was in dash's original post and the other referred to Mark McGwire's 62nd home run. Both suggested that the runners could have been called out for being assisted.

That particular violation (runner assisted by a base coach) only applies during a live ball. When the batted balls in those cases passed over the fence for a home run the ball became dead. In neither case could those B/R's be called out for being assisted by a base coach.

Neither OBR nor NCAA limits the violation to a live ball situation. FED says the coach can't assist the runner during "playing action," and the touching of awarded bases is certainly playing action, even though the ball is dead. I think the penalty would still apply.

For Fed, at least, Case book 3.2.2 Situation A says otherwise.

I haven't read the caseplay reference but you certainly have a coach assist a runner on a dead ball award BUT it would be a very, very limited basis. There is no rule that says anything about another assisting a runner. Any hand slapping or shaking hands oes not qualify. You see many times players telling each other not to touch the runner before he touches the plate on a HR. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that. Where you get a problem is when they block out seeing him touch. Also, in NCAA they don't want the players on the dirt area because of taunting issues.

quote:

Originally posted by pilsner:
For Fed, at least, Case book 3.2.2 Situation A says otherwise.

I saw that and it's not really analogous. In situation A, the coach helps a runner to his feet after he tripped (there was no missed base). The ruling is "this type of assistance" is allowed. Helping a runner to his feet after he tripped is very different than grabbing him to make him touch a missed base, for which he would be out on proper appeal.

In situation B(b), the home run is "going over the fence," when the coach physically assists the runner at 3rd. In this case, the runner is out on the coach's assistance. It seems to me that if the runner is out for coach's assistance on a ball that is "going" over the fence, he would also be out on a ball that has "gone" over the fence.

But I can see your point. The answer is not clear from the rule.

IMO, the difference between the explanations (going over vs gone over) is that going over the ball is still considered live and gone over the ball is considered dead.

quote:

I saw that and it's not really analogous. In situation A, the coach helps a runner to his feet after he tripped (there was no missed base).

In your original post there was no missed base but you suggested the runner could be called out (not that he should be) under rule 3-2-2 for being assisted.