This post is for those parents that are afraid they don’t have enough money to help their sons to play college baseball. After reading the hsbbw for many years I see the emotions, the involvement, and the sacrifices made by the parents it trying to help their sons get to the next level. You can bet I’m not the only one that sees this. Others see this as a financial opportunity. They know they can sell a service or a product promising to help your son’s get to the next level in exchange for your money. You probably don't want to hear this but you are an easy target because you are emotionally involved. I think it is getting out of hand and many people are spending a great deal of money on the recruiting game when it’s not necessary while others may feel they are at a disadvantage because they can't afford to help their sons. I have seen the recruitment of players transform from coaches doing the work and looking for talented players into a situation where most parents are spending LOTS of money on showcases, camps, and recruiting services. Let me give you my (a parent’s) perspective on all this. Understand that I have no dog in the hunt as my son has already been through all this and I make no money from any player getting to the next level. I have no showcase, no recruiting service, sell no DVD’s, or don’t charge for lessons to make a player better.
If you live within a budget then I would have a separate baseball budget and spend accordingly. Ignore the marketing hype and work YOUR plan. Folks there are a defined number of baseball scholarships and each one of these scholarships will be awarded to the best players the coaches can find ---- and rest assured coaches are always looking everywhere they can for these players. I hear lots of skewed stories about how coaches no longer have the time or the money to recruit players. Not true. Those stories are perpetuated by those that are in the "exposure business". Coaches are continually recruiting in any way they can. Sure they use showcases, combines and camps (and possibly a recruiting service). They also use their baseball network, high school coaches, college coaches, summer coaches, newspapers, internet, boosters, word of mouth, talk on the street, and baseball publications. Scholarships are awarded on the player’s talent, and on the team's needs, not how much exposure he received. There are thousands of baseball marketers “selling” the same scholarships to players that would probably get them anyway. So if you have the money and want to spend it, that is your call. I know there are many reputable people involved in the marketing of baseball exposure but that alone is not a reason to buy it. Of course exposure is necessary but do you have to spend thousands of dollars on it? I say not. Whether you do or not --- I would venture to say the outcome would remain close to the same.
Fungo

Many of us hope you are right, but it is an uphill battle. I've many friends in the game and insist that it has to be done or you can forget it; your schools to small for coaches to recruit, they don't have the time to follow all leads, coaches don’t or won’t do anything to help a kid, etc. I know some folks who have their kids on several travel teams as well as attending as many showcases as they can schedule. When I question the sanity of it all the answer is it is the way it works now. “This isn’t recreational ball anymore. The kid has to play against the best talent to get better”, and so you have to spend the money to put them on those teams.

My pocketbook, only allows so much and I want development along with exposure and I'm afraid a thousand dollars a season, every season is not in my budget.

It's tough but lets not make it tougher than it really is. Obrady, it's only human nature for those that spend excessive money to tell you they are doing the "right" thing and you need to do it too. It gets insane. I have actually seen players showcase on the east coast, pack their bags hop a plane and head directly to the west coast to showcase. In talking to these parents they seem to look at this showcasing as something more than exposure. It becomes some sort of accomplishment or something that adds to their son's resume.
Fungo

Have to agree with Fungo on this one. Son was at the PG Northeast Underclass Monday and Tuesday. He's just entering his jr year and that's the only showcase he opted to request an invite to this year. While sitting in the stands I overheard numerous discussions between parents who's sons had attended one or more college camps, and three or four showcases already and have additional camps and showcases scheduled through Labor Day. Even if I had the finances to make that happen, I wouldn't. I don't see the need to have my son attend a showcase run by every major showcase association and attend camps at schools he's not serious about attending.

Felt pretty good about my line of thinking when, on Tuesday morning, John Lester, LHP for the Red Sox, addressed the boys (and parents) and, when asked about showcases and such, told those assembled that he recommended they limit activity to one or two showcases. He said its not a good idea to burn your son out by having him play year round ball and attend a lot of showcases and camps. He said a couple of good showcases are all that's actually necessary to get your son in front of enough scouts and recruiters to get his name in circulation. He also said that he did not play baseball year round and he attended a total of 4 showcase events between his sophomore and senior years. He ended up being the first player the Red Sox took in the 2002 draft.

We saw some really talented ballplayers in the past couple of days, and some guys that are really average. I don't know which players have parents showcasing them all over the place, but I have to believe the ones who were outstanding won't be hurt by a lighter schedule and the ones who are average probably won't be helped.

quote:

I have to believe the ones who were outstanding won't be hurt by a lighter schedule and the ones who are average probably won't be helped

I agree with this entirely. I don't have any thing against showcasing. My son only did local showcases and a couple of camps due to a limited budget. He always played ball year round, but that was because of a love for playing..... not to be seen. He also bypassed more elite teams to stay with his HS teammates because that's where he felt HE belonged.

I think as Fungo said, that many of us recommend paths we took though because it worked for us. We must all realize that we have different goals and expectations for our kids and they do for themselves as well. For some, to spend $1000s of dollars travelling across the country doesn't intrude on their budget and they will feel it contributed to Jr receiving multiple offers from big schools. Bottom line: your son only needs the offer from the school with the right fit!

KmomNH.

Hi, First off....How did it go for your son?

I am of the same beliefs as Kmom on this, my son is the same age as hers, and he is not doing any of these events this summer. In my opinion and his, he is not ready to do them.

He had a good sophmore year in HS, but tailed off at the end of it. He did ok at Legion over the summer, but now realizes he did not put the real effort and work in that is required to be successful at these levels of ball. He has started to rededicate himself into the conditoning and drill work. We have agreed that if he continues this and there is a levle of consistency with both his pitching and hitting that then we will begin to look at a couple of events. We are certainly not going to be spending next summer going from showcase to showcase though. There were many players on his legion team this summer going to different camp/showcase type events. Some of the boys are definitely ready for it and I am sure will get some extra looks because of it. A few of them were just wasting money in my opinion.

At this point, I truely believe my son would be one of those average players if he attended one. Even worse, the expectations for him would be more than his current skills would live up to. The expectations that have always come because of his physical size and the "potential" he posseses. His is 6'5", just under 200 lbs and a lefty.

I beleive it is very important while you are trying to figure out what level of financial commitment you can put into this, that you are brutally honest with yourself and your son. It is one thing to be a stand out locally, it is indeed something else to go away from the comfort level of home and compete for a roster spot and playing time. We have done this, and it allows us and our son to realize that just having "potential" is not enough. If he is not willing to get up in the morning and take that run, or get the weight work done, or do the drills for his pitching delivery, he is not ready to be given the opportunity to go to a showcase event. You as a parent MUST be ready to say no if you dont see the commitment on his part. In my opinion, this is absolutely critical if you have other children and also want to give them the best of opportunities in what ever endeavors they are involved in.

Kmom and I are in similar situations. We both have only the one son and that allows us to focus the time and money to provide these opportunitites for them. We both have gone through difficult times with our own professions at the same time we were doing the AAU scene all over New England.

I strongly believe her son has done a tremendous job over the past couple of years and has positioned himself to get the maximum he can from this game. I have told her many times privately, and will state it again here openly....She should be (and I know she is) extremely proud of how he has handled himself and his desire to play the game. I am very glad for him and for her.

A parent will want to do everything in their power to give their a child as many chances at a achieving their dream.

If a player is going to many showcases and camps then one would think they are just an average player to continue to seek exposure.

Fungo.....outstanding post with which I wholeheartedly agree!

Thanks for sharing such fabulous thoughts!

quote:

A parent will want to do everything in their power to give their a child as many chances at a achieving their dream.

I agree this is probably close to correct in most situations. Unfortunately for the many parents who spend a lot of money, the issue ultimately, and I think correctly, focuses itself on "Can you play?" and "If so, how well?"
Personally, I think Fungo provides great guidance and insight into the process and he provides it with the knowledge he gained during Josh's recruiting and combines it with his skill, experience and ability to look back and analyze.
If you are a very top player, college and pro scouts are going to find you.
Showcasing/travel teams/recruiting services, etc "service" the vast majority of players at the next levels. In many circumstances they are for parents who are not very confident about their son's ability or who cannot assess where their son fits on a comparative basis with others.
Showcasing/travel teams/recruiting organizations also seem to be a byproduct of the all important "signing with a DI" and/or announcing a "scholarship."
Having the opportunity to look back, I agree those are moments of pride for parents and for sons.
Honestly, though, they are short lived and, to me at least, absolutely the wrong emphasis. Maybe I am rationalizing because our son played football and baseball and stayed with his local legion team, with his only major college exposure being at the Stanford Camp. He ended up at a DIII where he proved he could play and, in effect, used summer wood bat leagues to "showcase" his ability to compete well with those at the highest levels of DI.
If he had showcased more in high school, his subsequent success suggests he may well have ended up at a DI program. However, he would never change the choice of the DIII that he made and whether he played DI or DIII, would likely not have changed whether he got drafted and would still be playing.
As Fungo concludes, and I fully agree, all the showcases/travel teams/recruiting services probably don't end up changing the end result too much. The ultimate result is determined by how well you play and how much you improve and adjust. The ultimate result is governed by the efforts of the player, no matter how hard or how much the parents might try to make it different.

quote:

If you live within a budget then I would have a separate baseball budget and spend accordingly. Ignore the marketing hype and work YOUR plan.

Great post Fungo!

When you say "WORK YOUR PLAN", you are so right. I would add however that you need to be somewhat flexible with that plan. Almost 4 years ago our plan on paper was easy, a good academic D1 school, with a positive baseball program, and we thought we had a fit from day 1. Our problem was we are one of the Tundra tribes from the North and that only D1 in WI never even recruited the kid . There goes the plan and all of a sudden we had to do the dreaded "Out of State" march. Change in plans, and our baseball fund was turned upside down in his Junior year.

Bottom line is the recruiting dollar can be significant on the surface, but in many cases the potential out of State tuition costs were X-fold more than the pre-college baseball fund. I am a tight wad and do not have real deep pockets but while we didn't need all the marketing hype options that were out there we did know that they were available and took a "you can pay me now or pay me later" approach.

Cheapest way to get noticed is by playing on the best select team your son can PLAY on. You do not get noticed by collecting trophys. Second you don't
need to travel across the country to support the economy just be aware to what caliber of competition you will be playing against.
Most larger cities have AABC affilation leagues
that bring large numbers of scouts in for state and
regional qualifier games. Here in Dallas, scouts easily out numbered parents and fans in stands.
Everything PG and others do for you, you can do yourself.Its all so more rewarding

It just so happens our staff has been working on statistics that relate to this topic. At the risk of sounding like we are bragging here are some of the results. The entire list will appear on our site shortly. It does show that there are some players recruited at these colleges without attending our PG events. We are not sure if those players attended other showcase events. The truth is... 80% to 90% of players signing with top 50 type programs have attendeed PG events. Not sure exactly what that means.

Here is a partial list:

Miami FL Don’t have results of recruiting class yet, but know every year nearly every recruit attended PG events
Oklahoma State Don’t have results of recruiting class yet, but know they are mostly recruits who were at PG events
Stanford Don’t have results of recruiting class yet, but know they are mostly recruits who were at PG events
LSU 17 of 20 recruits attended PG events
Arkansas 15 of 21 recruits attended PG events
Texas 14 of 14 recruits attended PG events
Florida 14 of 14 recruits attended PG events
Clemson 14 of 15 recruits attended PG events
Texas A&M 14 of 16 recruits attended PG events
Georgia 14 of 16 recruits attended PG events
South Carolina 13 of 18 recruits attended PG events
North Carolina 12 of 14 recruits attended PG events
Baylor 10 of 12 recruits attended PG events
Arizona State 12 of 18 recruits attended PG events
Oklahoma 9 of 14 recruits attended PG events
Arizona 9 of 11 recruits attended PG events
Alabama 9 of 12 recruits attended PG events
Auburn 9 of 10 recruits attended PG events
Kentucky 9 of 17 recruits attended PG events
Ole Miss 9 of 11 recruits attended PG events
Florida Atlantic 9 of 11 recruits attended PG events
California 8 of 9 recruits attended PG events
Tennessee 8 of 8 recruits attended PG events
South Florida 8 of 10 recruits attended PG events
Georgia Southern 8 of 9 recruits attended PG events
UCLA 7 of 8 recruits attended PG events
Florida International 7 of 8 recruits attended PG events
Santa Clara 7 of 10 recruits attended PG events
South Alabama 7 of 9 recruits attended PG events
Stetson 7 of 7 recruits attended PG events
Nebraska 7 of 12 recruits attended PG events
Florida State 6 of 7 recruits attended PG events
Georgia Tech 6 of 7 recruits attended PG events
Virginia 6 of 9 recruits attended PG events
Rice 6 of 9 recruits attended PG events
Notre Dame 7 of 10 recruits attended PG events
Mississippi State 6 of 7 recruits attended PG events
Louisville 6 of 8 recruits attended PG events
North Carolina State 5 of 7 recruits attended PG events
Vanderbilt 4 of 6 recruits attended PG events
Virginia Tech 2 of 3 recruits attended PG events
Wake Forest 4 of 5 recruits attended PG events
Houston 5 of 7 recruits attended PG events
Tulane 4 of 5 recruits attended PG events
TCU 5 of 6 recruits attended PG events

Sometimes, the exposure you need isn't as much with college coaches as it is for him to see he belongs. I think that's what my son got out of showcasing more than anything else.

We set a budget before our oldest's Junior year of roughly $2,500. He stayed with his Legion team to the end because he felt a responsibility there, so we didn't do the select team thing. We went for a couple of showcases and a couple of college camps.

Certainly, we made some mistakes. But looking back on it, he came out OK.

He has one year of eligilibity left and three semesters of school. He's starting to look at the game differently. He's beginning to think long-term; he's talking to people he knows and has met about perhaps coaching.

Everybody has to work with a budget. But in our case, I think there is a value (that I'm seeing in him now) to the program we put together in high school.

.

Question...Why do we assume that the spending of this $ has to be considered wasted if a player does not get recruited heavily or signed?

IMO, you spend the money predominantly because it is a way for players and parent to spend some all-to-rare time together enjoying a common interest and learning life lessons....if it leads to something more then great. But if the ONLY reason that the money is being spend is the result then you have wasted the trip. And for many of us who have been there the trip IS the goal, the same way as any activity that unites the family.

For us the scholarship was nice, but from a financial standpoint hardly worth the amount of effort, money, time, and emotion. Frankly it doesn't pencil showcases, travel teams or not. But the trip does hold priceless memories of dusty ball fields, of moments of acheivement, of loss, of love, of humor, of just being a family on the road hour after hour connecting in a way that few families have the opportunity to do now a days with their sons.

While yes, there is a certain egotistical pride in the day we won the game and he signed the NLI, I can tell you now that all the high school, travel and recruiting ball is over that it is the trips, the moments of glory, the smiles, the tears, that I will remember, and cherish and miss the most. NOT how much money we did or didn't spend.

And as for me I'd spend twice that much, and put myself into debit (and have) just to have all those trips and all those moments together again, regardless of what it cost and what it did or didn't lead to.

After collegiate summer ball this year I could have flown him home, cheaply, but drove 20 hours there and 20 hours back just to connect. The trip made NO financial, or physical sense and it did not lead to any baseball epiphany or award but I can tell you that it was worth every penny spent on gas and every mile we traveled together.

44
.

PGStaff,
You know I am pro showcase (within reason) but I want people to thing about the showcase phenomenon and how it has impacted the recruiting cycle. Your list is very impressive! However it only proves to me that Perfect Games is very effective in identifying talent, recruiting talent, and assembling talent and everyone knows talented players have always been recruited in the past and will always be recruited in the future with or without Perfect Game. Your list perpetuates this showcase phenomenon to the emotionally involved parent. It appears these players “must” go thru the PG pipeline to secure a scholarship but in reality these players are recruited and funneled thru the PG events by effective identification, recruiting, marketing, and execution of their showcases. As a former businessman (retired last month) I realize you have a great business plan and as your name implies, you have executed it to perfection. You have a very good reputation and I know you offer a service that is beneficial to the player needing exposure. But in my opinion showcasing has become excessive and has turned into a very expensive “ritual” for the uninformed parent. This over-showcasing has turned recruiting into something other than what it needs to be. Are these events “bad”? Absolutely NOT! They are very effective venues for showcasing a player’s talent to those coaches in attendance. But they are expensive and the misconception that about exposure has put some parents between a financial rock and a hard place. If multiple showcases and excessive exposure were needed I would be the first to sound the alarm. Let’s take a closer look at your stats ---

You say: “ The truth is... 80% to 90% of players signing with top 50 type programs have attendeed PG events. Not sure exactly what that means.”
It only means they attended a PG event ---- period. However I’m pretty good at reading between the lines and in doing so it suggest ---- “Statistics prove in order to attend a top 50 program odds are you must attend a PG event”--- and I have a problem with that suggestion.
One could say 100% played high school baseball and 97% played on better than average summer teams but in terms of playing for a top 50 team these percentages are meaningless. It simply means this is what those players did prior to signing with their college.

I wonder ---- With the increase of PG events and other showcases are we seeing an increase in scholarships being given to baseball players?
and---As PG fine tunes their showcases are you seeing a higher percentage of your attendees being signed to top 50 programs?
One final question: Do showcases make the player ---OR --- Do players make the showcase ---OR --- do they compliment each other?
Fungo

Fungo - Terrific thread!

On the one hand I know, FOR SURE, that showcases helped our son gain exposure and attain the options that we desired for him. At least 3 of his 5 final college choices "found" him at a showcase. It opened other doors too...an opportunity to play for the USA Jr. National team, an AFLAC selection. These memories can never be replaced. We remain very grateful to PG and TeamOne for those opportunitites. THANK YOU PGStaff!

On the other hand, I hear parents today being sucked in when it is either a waste of their money and time or they really don't need it anyways. Just a few weeks ago a father of a boy I believe has no chance, whatsoever, to play college ball told me he wants to sit down and discuss which showcases his son should attend. Should my answer be none?

I see organizations starting to run showcases that I don't think know anything about running showcases. What good will it do? Make money for them?

And I've said this before and unfortunately I believe its not fully appreciated why I have this view...but I see parents of 13-year olds starting to consider paying $$ for showcases for their sons. WHY!?!? Can we just let kids be kids a little while longer?! Do these events even need to exist? WHY?!?!?

Fungo...you are a wise man. Your advice at the beginning of this thread is very good advice and should be read carefully by any parent of a HS ballplayer. I too am pro-showcase. But the panic I hear from today's HS parents is unnecessary and I hope HS parents will re-read what Fungo has to say about this. It is good advice. Have a plan. Have a budget. Don't get caught swinging at empty air.

Observer44 and Fungo - great posts IMO.

Observer - if one were to look at it from a purely financial perspective - 99% of the parents who go through this process would be making what could only be described as idiotic financial decisions.
The "pot at the end of the college baseball recruiting rainbow" is filled with a bag of donuts and a couple bucks for the vast majority of players/parents. Its the trip - not the destination - I agree.

Fungo - your post is thought provoking in many ways. What really caught my eye was the schools listed. There were about 45. All big namers.
I would love to know about the other 900 or so schools as well to get a complete picture.

What I have seen more than ever with the young players is the shift away from actually playing the game and winning as a team - and towards a showcase mentality.
What is my time in the 60? - how hard am I throwing? - what is my bat speed? etc...

I hear less and less about actually playing the game - and more and more about "tools" and being "toolsy" (God I hate that word).

If I see one more "toolsy" player in a baseball game playing like garbage - I am going to puke.

So many great posts in this thread

Fungo - congrats on your retirement - may that allow you to travel the country following your son playing baseball.

OldVaman - good point about the showcase letting your son measure his abilities against others.

justbb - What do you tell the father? I would say ob44 has provided excellent advice. Use the event as a way to experience something as a family, and then maybe the results are secondary to that end. If the parent has the wherewithall to afford the events, what does it matter at the end of the day how many they attend? As ob44 points out, there can be value in merely doing certain things.

its - you see the same stuff going on in other sports as well. Every year guys get drafted in the NFL and all you hear about is their great combine numbers but not a lot said about their productivity on the field. You then watch these same individuals play and just scratch your head

Fungo, Observer44, Itsinthegame,

Thank you for your insight and expereinces on this very tricky subject.

I can't speak for everyone, but for myself & my family it is greatly appreciated. As we are at the beginning of this adventure, your input is invaluable to us.


PGstaff,

I agree with the others that your organization has done a great job, but in regards to your numbers....

How many of those players would have ended up where they did or in an equivalent program if PG did not exist? My guess would be most of them. The overhelming majority of the schools you listed are cream of the crop. The players they are recruiting would obviously be the very top of those available each year. If a player being looked at by Miami did not actually get selected to attend Miami, I am sure any of the other schools you listed would be very interested in him.

Perhaps a better statistical breakdown would be one done by a 3rd party that would show all the showcase type of events attended by a player and the schools that eventually extended offers to him.

As I stated earlier, I know of a few boys here that at 16 have already gone to multiple events (I dont know if any were PG events), and to be honest several of these boys may not even crack the starting lineups on their HS squads this next year. Yet their parents are spending $$ and traveling all over to put the kids into these events.