quote:

Regardless it shows that you can be dominant in the low 80s.

We all agree a pro pitcher can be successful in the low 80's. It is remarkable because it happens so rarely, imo.

quote:

Originally posted by BobbleheadDoll:
I watched Mussina today for a few innings against the Red Sox. He lived between 79-82 mph. He ran a few up to high 80s and they were his least effective pitches. He dominated for 6 innings with low 80s pitches.

This was your original statment regarding Mussina.
Now you state you watched him pitch and he ran it up to 88 and was dominating and you only watched 3 innings.

No one claims that low 80's pitchers can't dominate. I think it's very much understood by all that to receive attention with low velo you have to know how to pitch and have a huge arsenal.

You got to get your facts straight.

FWIW, I have been following FSU baseball for 3 years and sat at about live 15 games, never once did I see a pitcher throw 60's, never. You stated you knew this by listening to what was stated by announcers, now you just told Dad04 not to listen to what commentators say.

You are very confusing.

TPM as usual you come looking for trouble.

You as I have stated have a problem with the English language amoung other things.

I said he threw a half dozzen pitches over 82 mph and they were either out of the strike zone or nailed. He seemed to struggle with his pitches that he ran up in the high 8os.

I don't listen to color commentators who theorize and make up stuff to theorize on BB. I do give them credit for being able to relate radar gun readings.

Another brain teaser for an idiot.

Greg Maddux, Jamie Moyer................neither would even get a look these days. Not the prototype build or velocity Experience, location, movement, change of speeds, undue respect from the umps (and big, big bucks). Both get it done, and I'd take either one.

Maddux was pitching 90's out of HS.

Why did he lose velocity?

plash
they got old on us.

bobble
it is my belief, and only a belief.that 90 gets you signed, then performance takes over. there are exeptions,but not as many as pitchers in the 90's.or i should say pitchers that have thrown 90.

There is a much larger margin for error with a guy throwing mid 90's. Most MLB guys start out as hard throwers and then those who learn the art of pitching survive while others have shorter careers. It's the rare pitcher who masters the art well enough, young enough, to make it to MLB without a quality fastball in the first place.

Most of the guys you see in MLB throwing soft were once harder throwers. Maddux and Glavine were 90+ in their youth. As pitchers age, very few have the moxie to get batters out as their stuff fades. But that is what distinguishes Maddux and Glavine as Hall of Famers.

In Glavine's case, I believe he is capable of still throwing 85-86, but he found that that is considered FAT by hitters. He couldn't dial it up higher any more, so he went DOWN instead. His ERA still got up well above 4 before his elbow started giving him trouble, but lots of teams would like to have a guy with a sub-5 ERA right now.

Part of what makes these guys effective is that they mess with batters' timing. The fact that they are few and far between is a large part of why it works for them. If everyone threw in the low 80's, today's MLB hitters would feast on them all.

Heck, even in our area high school play, if you're throwing 80-85, it'd better be in good spots with good movement and backed up with at least one solid offspeed pitch, or you're meat.

We'd all like to believe that just anyone can make it in MLB if they just work hard enough. Sorry, it ain't so. Most of them do work their tails off, but they combine that with the advantage of starting out as gifted athletes.

I know a guy who records novelty songs, and one of them is titled, "Somebody Else Got to Be Jimmy Buffet". As you might guess, it's a loser's lament -- I get drunk a lot, I like the beach, I'm pudgy, balding and I can't sing, so why can't I be a star? Well, maybe there's only room for the one. When everyone starts doing it, it doesn't work very well.

quote:

Originally posted by plash3:
Why did he lose velocity?

I think Midlo Dad gave a good explanation. I think they all had high velo and as they got older they reinvented themselves. SI article stated that Glavine did it with more use of the CB.

A few years ago I read an article where he once told someone about relying on mathmatical odds (used in betting) in throwing pitches taught by his father (a dealer in Las Vegas). He always seems to have an uncanny way of out thinking the hitter. Would you agree?