What I am trying to do here is to show how many players actually get drafted and sign out of HS. The first column is Team/HS players drafted by that team/College players drated by that team/Juco players drafted/other sources/Pitchers drafted/position players drafted/how many players they signed/ how many signess are hs players.
A total of 538 hs players drafted, only 135 signed. There were a total of 752 signed players all together. What surprised me was how few hs players are being signed by pro teams.
Unless you are drafted very high and get big money, there is no reason why a kid should give up a college scholarship which gives him an opportunity to mature and improve his game as opposed to signing for peanuts and winding up eating at McDonalds; driving a old beatermobile; calling mom and dad for money; and, being unable to speak to 1/2 of your teammates because you slept through Spanish class!
There is a good reason or five why not many HS kids are being signed.1. Most are not anywhere near ready physically for pro ball.2. Most want more money than they are worth. 3. The college experience is important. 4.Most are not mature enough mentally to be out on their own.5.Most can't compete at the pro level when they are 18.6. About a 100 kids across the nation are ready.......the rest are not.
Posts: 3823 | Location: Ca. | Registered: December 26, 2002
If that is true, however (and I agree with you)...then why are there so many Latin players in the low minors (some rosters in excess of 50%)...they surely are no ****her ahead physically than the locals?
Do you think the 400+ baseball players who had years added to their age in the last year or so, has something to do with their "maturity" level and ability to compete with kids in the US? I mean, if you're 21 and your birth certificate says you are 18, surely that makes a difference physically?
You are correct with your conclusion on the high school player. You and I noticed this trend 5 years ago when you coach the Giants Area Code Teams. Each year, we evaluate the players selected to play and the players drafted the following June.
The California teams average 50% draftable. the Texas Rangers Team selected from Texas, Oklahoma and Louisiana was 70% draftable.
For this reason, we have reduced the total number of our Area Code teams to seven this year. California, Nevada and Hawaii will provide players for the two Brewers teams
A total of 175 players will be selected for the seven teams in 2004. Recently, during our December journey to Australia, a pro scout related to me; Bob, I do not see "creativity" in our American players.
He is absolutely correct. The Latin American players, the Australian players, the Korean, the Chinese and the Japanese high school age players are in an Academy like programs "learning the game". We will all need to make adjustments: players, parents, coaches and pro scouts.
Thank you again BB Scout for your presentations.
Bob Williams
Posts: 144 | Location: Santa Rosa,CA USA | Registered: April 20, 2003
quote:Originally posted by BeenthereIL: Good points, bb.
If that is true, however (and I agree with you)...then why are there so many Latin players in the low minors (some rosters in excess of 50%)...they surely are no ****her ahead physically than the locals?
Do you think the 400+ baseball players who had years added to their age in the last year or so, has something to do with their "maturity" level and ability to compete with kids in the US? I mean, if you're 21 and your birth certificate says you are 18, surely that makes a difference physically?
John, It is now two years since the ages were taken care of, but I will bet that the Latin kids will still be more ready for pro ball than the American kids. They are not spoiled, and when they get their lousy little paycheck, they send about 30% of it back home to help out. They don't need a million dollars to sign a pro contract, they just want the chance. They don't have Mommy and Daddy calling the coach to make sure things are going Jr's way. Heck, they are supporting Mom and Dad and their brothers and sisters.
When our kids are 18, they are about 7 years younger between the ears than the Latin kids.They are also not as mature as we were at their age.
I told this story about a year ago, but will tell it again. When I signed at 17, my mom put me on a plane to Salt Lake, where I changed planes and flew into Twin Falls ID. The season had already started and they were settled in and I was reporting at about game 5 of the season. When I landed in Twin Falls, there was no body there, so I grabbed a cab and told the guy to take me to the park. It was about 1pm and so I sat on my bags until the Mgr. showed up at about 2:30. He said, who are you? I said McMillan. He said "where the he*l have you been"? He took me inside and gave me a uniform. I asked him where I could stay and he said go down to the bullpen and see if any one needs a roomate. One guy was living at a Hotel and said that we could split the price of the room. I said great.The next day I called my folks and said that I was all set up and things were great. If we did that today, Mommy would be on the phone calling the GM and screaming child abuse.No one to meet you at the airport? No family to stay with? Heck no, I had $50 in my pocket and was playing pro ball and that was all I cared about.
The Latin players do what I did, except they don't have the $50 that I had.
Posts: 3823 | Location: Ca. | Registered: December 26, 2002
Great post! Frankly one thing that I don't understand is the feeling that a kid has to become set for life or he doesn't sign. It says 2 things to me. 1. maybe the kid maybe doesn't have the mental makeup to make it. 2. Some parents don't want to see their son fail, so they put unreasonable numbers on him to make him go to school.
I still contend that the only true baseball scholarship is the MLB scholarship. I know that TR and others will say that most don't go back to school. That is on them. I know my son wants to be an engineer and that is one of the hardest majors to take and play d=1 ball. He feels that if he chases his dream and doesn't cut it then he will go back to school and get his degree in engineering unencumbered by having to play ball.
Parents wanting x amount of dollars never made sense to me because let us face it when one graduates college and gets a job, they do not pay huge "life changing" bonuses. Who ever said that you have to financially set to chase your dream. Yes, enough money to supplement your income while you are in the minors is nice, it is not the same thing as being financially set for life.
The difference between my son and a latin player is that he has options. Nowadays, we, as upper, middle class parents don't prepare our kids to go into the working world at 17-18. The way I see it, it is a job and one must ask if their son is emotionally prepared for any job, even the job of baseball. Problem is with our infatuation and love for the game, not all parents see it that way. My son has to call me to tell me that his car is making funny noises, the thought of his car breaking down in the middle of nowhere (in town a few miles from home) scares him. I can't see him going to the middle of nowhere without a place to live. And he is mature for his age! I know things are different these days, teams help to prepare the transition for the young players, but you get the jist of what I am saying. Bighit, I think that is why you see so few signing after certain rounds, why to some, going to Juco as a draft and follow gives more comfort than the unknown. Of course the large signing bonus helps to ease the transition, isn't this what americans teach their kids?
Posts: 10774 | Location: South Florida | Registered: July 28, 2003
BB50, you make good points. Especially about the latin players having less options. Everyone has different perspectives. the Florida Bombers "I love the HSBBW"
Posts: 5104 | Location: South Florida | Registered: December 26, 2002
Bighit, Good take on the engineering. I played tennis for a D1 school my junior season and if I had been on the traveling squad I doubt that I could have maintained my grades. The practices, weight work and conditioning were more than enough. I was off sequence and had to take many of my required engineering courses my senior year and I'll guarantee that I couldn't have maintained my grades and played tennis both.
Posts: 4703 | Location: Southern CA, USA | Registered: January 02, 2003
Bighit, I have a comparison of players drafted out of HS who did not go pro and were drafted later out of college. Most were drafted in higher rounds and received more money. Interesting. Some where never drafted in the first place.
Posts: 10774 | Location: South Florida | Registered: July 28, 2003
bbscout As always you have the right answer to all the questions about baseball. Other thing I want to add about the latin players is: For every american player that is signed from HS there are 10 players from latinamerica that had been signed as free agents. For every latin player that you see playing at the states there are hundred that just didn't get to that level. So, is unfair to just compare them. The real good HS players ( the 100 bbscout said) are as good as any latin player that makes the states could be. The hundred of anglos HS players that don't make it, are at the same level of hundred of latin players that we never get to know their names.
"Peace is, the respect for the other people's rights". Benito Juarez
No parent should prevent their child from following their dreams. I suspect what most of us do is give our sons the best advice we can based upon our life experiences.
Its not so much that a boy has to be set for life - for, as Baseonballs50 says, "he has options" it's hard to argue with the value of a college education, so if he can make progress toward that degree, play ball, mature, and still follow a dream 3 or 4 years down the road, there is nothing wrong with that decision.
When I read topics such as this and when I've had discussions with my own son, I am always vividly reminded of the May afternoon a few days before my graduation from high school, when my dad, (who was a WWII Marine combat veteran and had been a Marine Corp Drill Instructor invited me out to the patio, carrying a couple of ice cold Coors beers. It was the Vietnam era and I had been weighing taking a D-1 BB scholarship or joining the Marines. After sipping his beer for a while, he said "son, you are 18 years old and I'm not going to tell you what to do. You are old enough to make that decision for yourself, but I've seen war and I've seen baseball and if it were me, I'd play baseball." He drained his beer, stood up, patted me on the shoulder and said, "what ever you chose, I love you" then he walked back into the house.
Posts: 89 | Location: Colorado | Registered: September 15, 2003
quote: Its not so much that a boy has to be set for life - for, as Baseonballs50 says, "he has options" it's hard to argue with the value of a college education, so if he can make progress toward that degree, play ball, mature, and still follow a dream 3 or 4 years down the road, there is nothing wrong with that decision.
Baseonballs50 maeks some great points. We don't have our boys ready to go into the work force at 17 and 18. We prepare them for college and then joining the work force.
I do feel that the argument can be made that the only true scholarship is the MLB scholly. I mean, if you get injured and get your scholarship pulled then you don't have the MLB option anymore. If you go to MLB and get injured, then you still have the scholly. I also believe that most kids do not know what they want to do right out of hs and change majors at least once. There are studies to back that up right away. My wife is a Prof of Math Ed. She is also supportive of going back to school or waiting a year to get the bearings. Others may feel that it is ok to spend 5 or 6 years to get centered and get a degree.
I am not saying that one is right and the other wrong, just that it is a very personal decision. I just don't get it when parents put out that they need 700K to sign or they will go to school. Only top 2 rounds will get that and that will probably be 15-20 hs kids at most. The value of an education is the value of an education. It is no less valuable in 5 years and may be more so if a kid goes back without the distractions of having to play baseball. JMO
Big, You are right it is a personal decision. When looking over the top 10 rounds from last year, most signed, I never realized it and it is amazing some signed for absolutely nothing IMO to follow their dream. All(HS) are given the opportunity to go into the college scholarship program, most out of HS probably never will take advantage of it. Afterall, there are those that argue the value of a college education these days. My daughter never went to college and she makes more than the average college grad, though her career options are limited. However, the way I see it, there are some college programs with awesome coaches that will prepare the player for the next level. Besides getting to the CWS, they feel that it is their responsibility to run a program as such, afterall it does place more value on their program and in the end it is their ultmate goal to be able to tell that to their recruits year after year. In the comparison I have, most that were drafted who went to college got more $$$ in their next eligible draft. Some were never drafted at all. It's just a matter of where the 17-18 year old feels he will fit in and grow as a young man into an adult. He has to decide what willbe his best options in the long run, with guidance from his parents and those that are able to give unbiased advice. See you later!
Posts: 10774 | Location: South Florida | Registered: July 28, 2003
Good story. Close to the same thing happened with me and my dad. Unfortunately it was after we had a spat and I had already enlisted. Oh well, I'd like to think it definitely forced me to grow up fast.
baseonballs50,
More than likely, the ones that signed for almost nothing were college seniors who had no leverage left.
Big,
Not to be argumentative, because I really don't know, but how high do you have to get drafted before you get the college package? I imagine it's on a case by case basis, but overall IMO the pro's would have to want you pretty bad to give you the college package. Top 20 rounds??
Frank
______________ Never put both feet in your mouth at the same time, because then you don't have a leg to stand on.
Posts: 1692 | Location: Pueblo,CO,USA | Registered: December 27, 2002
The MLB v. College decision is very difficult for the good student without doubt. The right decision for one may not work for another.
If its deep in a kids heart to play pro ball, he truely believes he belongs and will be comfortable and confident in the situation, give it your best shot. The difference between success and failure in many endeavors is found between the ears. I know little about a lot of things but I'm betting baseball in no different.
The focus and will required can't be priced out like physical tools. Those lucky enough to have the choice should consider it carefully. We can't change the past or guarrantee the future. Make the best of today.
Posts: 4789 | Location: Florida | Registered: December 26, 2002
