what is another good pitch to go with a change up, fastball and curve ball?

In many cases, thats enough. Do you throw both 2 and 4 seam fb's? Two fastballs equal two different pitches if they are thrown with movement. I can only suggest that you work on locating the pitches you have. Once you learn to control those pitches, you can begin taking steps toward commanding one of them. Also, what age group are you?

2 seam, 4 seam, c/u, curve will get it done.

First pitch for a strike is the best pitch I know of.

quote:

Do you throw both 2 and 4 seam fb's

If you cut or sink your 2 seam then you have 3 fb's
Is your arsenal not getting it done?

quote:

Originally posted by Bighit15:
First pitch for a strike is the best pitch I know of.

Amazing how often folks get so smart and sophisticated that they forget this important fundamental. Git ahead and you're likely to git 'er done.

quote:

Originally posted by Bighit15:
First pitch for a strike is the best pitch I know of.

Amen to that!! As for another pitch. Have you tried a slider?

Why not learn Axis understanding and control so that you can learn 6 pitches, 3 that move to the glovearm side and 3 that move to the ballarm side? And even better yet all thrown pronated!! Fastballs that move both ways both 4 seam. A curve and it’s opposite the screwball. Then learn the forward axis pitches the Sinker and it’s oppositely axised pitch the Slider. When you learn how to control the ball axis as it fans forward all the way from both sides (horizontal axis) to directly forwards, you then have movement figured out. All of my 12 year olds have the first 4 of these pitches.

And all of your 12 yos would already be pitching in MLB right now if it weren't for a vast baseball conspiracy against Sir Isaac Newton.

Laflippin,

Why is everything you say at every thread a subtraction in learning?
What does your negative comments have to do with learning a new pitch?
Your non-stop tirades serve nobody!

Try saying something to the kid that will help him with a new pitch?

quote:

When you learn how to control the ball axis as it fans forward all the way from both sides (horizontal axis) to directly forwards, you then have movement figured out. All of my 12 year olds have the first 4 of these pitches.

---Sorry, Yardbird, since all of your 12 yos already have movement figured out I just assumed there must be a conspiracy that holds them back from their true potential...

Your self-aggrandizing outbursts are funny but the information you provided on spin axes of pitches is neither original to you or your spiritual leader, nor does it constitute any novel revelation.

Further, since the information you summarized has not been of any obvious service to Marshall's pitchers over the decades I do question your judgement for citing a completely anonymous (and alleged) group of 12 yo pitchers as a motivational tool on hsbaseballweb.

I did not see rPO24 respond to the question of his age? If you are under 14 2 seam and 4 seam FB (with cutter action from the index finger) and CU should be plenty. 14 and up start working the curve ball.

You might thry to throw what is called a "C-ball". Grip the ball between the thumb and index finger and throw it like a fast ball with a downward flip of the wrist on release. It should give you 12 to 6 movement. Learn to start it in the zone and it will land on the plate. Looks like a fast ball until the bottom falls out!

laflippin,

So, have you helped the kid yet?

Every body here has tried to help the kid sept one!

“---Sorry, Yardbird, since all of your 12 yos already have movement figured out I just assumed there must be a conspiracy that holds them back from their true potential..”

Apology unacceptable.

“Your self-aggrandizing outbursts are funny but”

I thought I was very calm and understanding that I am signed in as dirtberry that no aggrandizingment would be leverage able.

“the information you provided on spin axes of pitches is neither original to you or your spiritual leader, nor does it constitute any novel revelation.”

The information imparted there was for the kid??? I don’t believe you or anyone else has parted with this information here yet? I may be wrong.

”Further, since the information you summarized has not been of any obvious service to Marshall's pitchers”

Who says, You? You can’t even site one positive outcome!! Further?, you mean Fouler.

“I do question your judgment for citing a completely anonymous (and alleged) group of 12 yo pitchers as a motivational tool on hsbaseballweb.”

They are not anonymous, ask anybody in our South County area and they will point them out. I question your judgment on questioning my judgment when your judgment also includes HIGH JACKING another positive thread into what your mind thinks players want to here concerning their mechanics.

If the moderator wanted names here and only with parental permission would I give names to anyone here in a PM. But giving out names here to someone like you would
get my Arce kicked by somebody’s dad!

When are you going to help this kid with his question?

I would think that it is more important to master the pitches that he is throwing now before he moves on to trying new things


How accomplished is this young man when he is on the mound?

ridgePO24,

I tend to agree with the poster who responded that you may not need more than 3 basic pitch types to be effective.

Have you ever heard the phrase, "jack of all trades but master of none"? That would pretty much describe a common problem among young pitchers who jump around from one type of pitch type to another, rather than doing the repetitive work that is required to master a relatively small set of pitches.

Assuming your change-up is circle-change, c-change, palm ball, or related...make sure that you really understand how to throw a high-quality change-up from this family of pitches. Just as a starting place, it is a common error among young pitchers (and many coaches, for that matter) that change-ups are thrown with the palm forward at release point (like a fastball) and that the grip alone makes the pitch a change-up. Actually, this approach gives nothing more than a mediocre fastball, with too small of a velocity difference and not enough movement to be truly effective.

If you are throwing a circle-change (that seems to be the really cool CU to use, these days) then make sure you know how to throw it, mechanically, and then practice throwing it until you have confidence that you can use the pitch in any situation--for example, a 3-2 count, bases loaded, game on the line.

If you can't really throw your change-up correctly, consider replacing your current change-up with a split-finger fastball. The splitter is a very good surrogate for the change-up, and some pitchers have a much easier time with it because that does use a palm-forward release.

But, you don't need both a change-up and a splitter. One of these will do but you should work to develop a good one, whichever you choose.

For a breaking ball, consider letting your functional arm-slot choose the pitch type for you. If you want to throw a 12-to-6 yellow hammer like Koufax, but you are functionally a side-arm pitcher like Randy Johnson...well, that's just not going to work out for you, in my opinion.

If you are actually a "Randy Johnson" don't waste your time trying to learn mechanics that will allow you to throw a Koufax curveball. Instead, consider using a slider--a very effective breaking pitch that comes easily to many side-armers.

These are just some miscellaneous examples of concepts that a 1-on-1 coach could help you with.

Obviously, not knowing you personally, neither I nor any of the posters in your thread can give you customized advice that truly fits you as an individual. As you look at the confusing and sometimes contradictory opinion here and elsewhere you will likely start to understand the value of hands-on coaching that you can trust. Go find it.

LaFlippin,
Good post, I agree with a pitcher having too many pitches. Most ML pitchers don't and they throw the pitches that works best for them.

I heared a MLB pitcher last night say he had three good pitches he throws for strikes, FB inside, FB outside and CU.

Thanks, TPM.

My son has his hands full (pun intended) with learning three pitch types well.

There are quite a few people on this forum whose kids are pitching in HS, college, and pro levels (like your son)--I would venture a guess that most of the experienced voices basically agree with you.

"...FB inside, FB outside and CU..." That's very funny and, even better, it's probably very effective with outstanding command of location.

My kid has had pretty good success with the 2 seam (with movement in either direction depending on which finger he applies more pressure), 4 seam, curve and the occasional kb. Still working on the cu.

I think it is more important to throw 2 or 3 pitches well and from the same arm slot. It is so important to have deception in the form of delivering the fast ball, breaking ball, and change from the same arm slot, tempo, and arm speed. Master the basics first. You don't build a house by putting on the roof before the foundation. Small, young arms don't need to be stressed too much by doing too much different stuff. You can add pitches, finger pressure and varied pitches as you get older. One at a time.

"You don't build a house by putting on the roof before the foundation."

--Very well said, Bighit15. A bewildering array of pitch types will never substitute for a foundation of good conditioning and optimized mechanics, IMO.

My faux-Confucian interpretation of your metaphor:

"The man who builds his house from the top down will soon find himself homeless"